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Message |
    
Jim Hathaway
Member
Username: compassrose
Post Number: 45
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 10:36 pm: | 
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I have read where the admiralty invested in Lusitania, and that allowances were made in her design to facilitate conversion to an armed Merchant Cruiser.
Does anyone have knowledge of what these features were?
Honjitsu tenki seiro naredomo nami takashi-...
Akiyama Saneyuki
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Tom Lear
Member
Username: tlear
Post Number: 53
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 2:38 am: |
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Not very impressive - The blueprints from Shipbuilder show just 8 6" guns, four on each side of the shelter deck. Good for raiding commerce on the high seas, I suppose, but since Britain had the most commerce on the high seas to begin with, what was the point? When war actually did break out, German shipping vanished in a matter of weeks, almost of its own volition.
I get the impression that the provisions for including these guns in the design was more or less "window dressing" to pacify the Admiralty, and make it easier for the government to float its loan to Cunard.
It would be interesting to see how the plans for the Lusitania and Mauretania as armed cruisers compare to how the "Rolling Billy" was actually fitted out. There's an entry on that ship in the Jane's naval manual, the big one with the green slipcover. (Don't have it here with me so I can't be more specific) |
Jim Hathaway
Member
Username: compassrose
Post Number: 46
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 3:15 am: |
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Thanks, Tom,
Armed Merchant Cruisers were used in both WW-1 and 2 mostly as armed escorts in convoys.
I was curious how far the modification went- just gun mounts, or was there armor provided for ships vitals.
I would imagine ammunition would be in ready stowage lockers by the mounts since there was no provision for magazines and lifts.
Honjitsu tenki seiro naredomo nami takashi-...
Akiyama Saneyuki
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Noel F.Jones
Member
Username: ver1tas
Post Number: 389
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 4:09 am: |
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"On the outbreak of hostilities in 1914 she (Kaiser Wilhelm der Grosse) was requisitioned by the Imperial German Navy as an armed merchant cruiser. She was painted black overall and was fitted out with six 10.5 cm guns and two 3.7 cm cannon."
More can be found here:
http://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/discus/messages/6937/62515.html#POST90504
Noel |
Tom Lear
Member
Username: tlear
Post Number: 55
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 12:03 pm: |
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Thx, Noel. Roughly the same firepower as the Mauretania or Lusitania would have had, yet I get the impression she was largely ineffective as a raider. No real surprise - even using much more powerful Kriegsmarine warships in WW2, German surface raiding efforts were a bit uneven.
Did a bit more browsing of Shipbuilder, didn't see any mention of extra armor plating in the design. Doesn't mean that there wasn't any, but I doubt if there was. Emphasis seems to have been more on adequate subdivision to withstand collisions. The only mention of the Admiralty is their concern with the ships' overall dimensions and the reliability of the engines. Sounds almost like a mirror of Jackie Fisher's predilections for warship design - large massive hulls with almost no armor, relying instead on speed for protection. Given that influence of his on British warship design at the same time the Lusitania was designed (the British battlecruisers that sank at Jutland were Lusitania's contemporaries), I wonder if the Admiralty was content to sign off on the Lusitania with the same complacency and confidence they used to design battlecruisers with paper-thin hulls.
It's a bit of a stretch. Just thinking out loud here. |
Jim Hathaway
Member
Username: compassrose
Post Number: 48
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2005 - 5:21 am: |
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Thanks, Tom, and Noel,
I will have to do some more reading on British employment of Merchant Cruisers.
In WW-2 they were often employed in convoys as armed escorts.
It may just have been a pre-war theory that once the war started turned out to not be a very good one.
Of course, it may be that the value of the ships as fast transports would far outweigh thier value as a platform for a half dozen 6" guns.
Honjitsu tenki seiro naredomo nami takashi-...
Akiyama Saneyuki
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Michael Poirier
Member
Username: mike_poirier
Post Number: 30
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, January 20, 2005 - 4:23 am: |
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Survivor Ernest Cowper talked about certain features where the Lusitania could have mounted guns and showed these to fellow passengers. You can read what he has to say here
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/2216/clsctexts/Hubbard_Lusitania.htm
" God will get you for that Walter! "
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Jim Hathaway
Member
Username: compassrose
Post Number: 50
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, January 20, 2005 - 5:25 am: |
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Thanks, Michael, I will read it over my days off-
Thinking about it, she was equipped with the mountings at the beginning, so the intention would definitly be to use her as a raider. (in 1908)
Looking at SMS Emden,which was used as a raider, she probably would have made a deceint commerce raider so long as she did not run across any warships, but it would be a case of taking a valuable ship, well adapted to a vital role, and using her in a role she was not optimally adapted for, and other ships could do better-
Probably why it was not pursued during the war.
Honjitsu tenki seiro naredomo nami takashi-...
Akiyama Saneyuki
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Martin Owen Cahill
Member
Username: martin
Post Number: 303
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, January 20, 2005 - 11:59 am: |
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Michael,
Thanks for the Hubbard link. It is well worth reading even for it's overall story.
Martin |
