1st Class Cabins


Matt Smith

Member
Feb 24, 1998
99
1
238
What were some of the unoccupied first class cabins and if you were a passenger which one would you take? Oh one more thing if there were still unoccupied 1st class cabins why were some denied and put into the 2nd class?
 
C

Camron Miller

Guest
Hmmm... Isn't it those who were transferred from other White Star ships to the Titanic who were denied first class passage? They were first class passengers on other ships, but to travel first class, they'd have to have paid for an upgrade, as accomodation on the Titanic was so much more expensive. It wouldn't have been good economics to give free first class staterooms to so many, especially as most were very enthusiastic about being allowed to travel on the Titanic. Wasn't Eva Hart's father glad to have been given the chance to transfer?
 

Brian Ahern

Member
Dec 19, 2002
645
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183
I know what you're thinking of, Matt. In her interview with "Titanic: Death of a Dream" she said her family could have gone first class if all "the Americans" hadn't filled it. But this is simply not true. The only reason her family didn't go first was because her father clearly wasn't willing to pay for it.

Edith's mother was apparently very disappointed by this, so I've always had a theory that maybe Mr. Brown told his wife that first class was filled so that he could save some money without an argument.

-Regards,
Brian Ahern
 
D

David Haisman

Guest
Brian Ahern,

Perhaps you would like to enlarge on some of your assumptions regarding Thomas Brown's reluctance to pay a first class fare and my grandmothers apparent disappointment.

David Haisman
 
Jul 20, 2000
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Greetings Michael,

The 324 in 1st Class includes Alfred Nourney, who upgraded onboard from 2nd Class.

You have a passenger certificate stating that Titanic could carry 905 in 1st Class? -
The British Inquiry says 1034. - Might be interesting to count from the deck plans and or the Fares Rate booklet and see if one includes and the other excludes the sofa berths and uppper pullman berths that could be added "if required".

Regards,
Lester
 

Brian Ahern

Member
Dec 19, 2002
645
7
183
I stand truly and justly rebuked.

I was basing my assumptions (or presumptions) on Mrs Haisman's own words while being interviewed on camera for the tv show "Titanic: Death of a Dream" which is available on dvd.

But you are right - I have no business making off-the-cuff assumptions about the motives or actions of people who lived 90 years ago.

You have my sincere apologies.
-Brian Ahern
 
Jul 9, 2000
58,620
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Easley South Carolina
Lester, all I did was take a look at Passenger Certificate #1415 in the appendix which had the following breakdown;

1st Class: 905
2cnd Class: 564
3rd Class: 1134
Crew: 944
Total: 3547

No warranties offered on which figure is accurate, though this would hardly be the only example of confusing and inaccurate numbers given by the Wreck Commissiion, would it? I'll bet you could rattle of an impressive list of them!
wink.gif
 
Jul 20, 2000
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Greetings Michael,

My very appreciative thanks for that. - I had not previously seen #1415, so I will be checking the page 4 figures with interest. - E-deck [the Upper Deck] looks to be somewhat low. The others decks look as if they include the sofa and upper pullman berths which could be added "if required".

Many thanks,
Lester
 
Jul 9, 2000
58,620
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Easley South Carolina
Lester, if you have the printed copy issued by the PRO, I found this certificate on page 912. I haven't made much of a detailed study of the passenger accomadation being more concerned with forensics issues lately. The ability to add berths wouldn't surprise me though. It would be useful if business was booming.

A little caution may be in order here as my understanding of the certificated numbers wouldn't nesseccerily reflect what was actually fitted on the ship at the time, but only the maximum allowable.

Your results may really vary here in a big way. I'll be interested in seeing what you come up with.
 
Jul 20, 2000
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Hi Michael,

Yes I do and now you remind me I have seen it; but so long ago I had forgotten all about it.

With regard to the number of berths. The Boat deck is correct with 7 - five single berth rooms and one 2-berth. A-deck is correct with 76. Initially four 3-berth, but later rooms A-36 and A-37 were added. 30 single-berth, 28 of which could be fitted with a sofa-berth. So 6x3=18+30+28=76. - I will look at the other decks later.

Many thanks for the reminder.
Regards,
Lester
 
Jul 20, 2000
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Hi Michael,

The other decks:

B-deck - forward: 49 rooms: 27 single-berth. 24 of which could be provided with a sofa-berth. Four 2-berth and eighteen 3-berth. = 27+24+8+54=113

Aft: 50 rooms: Thirty-two 2-berth and six 3-berth = 64+18=82
There were also 12 rooms which show on deck plans as being 2-berth; but in a Fares Rate booklet are defined as single-berth [no sofa or upper Pullman-berths being mentioned]. These rooms are further defined as Servant's rooms for the Suites-of-Rooms. So 12 or 24?
113+82+12 = 207+12 = 219; which is the total on the List which you drew my attention to.

C-deck: 131 rooms: 16 single-berth of which 15 could be fitted with a sofa-berth or an upper Pullman-berth = 31
Fifty-eight 2-berth; 17 of which could be fitted with an upper Pullman-berth = 116+17 = 133
Sixty-one 3-berth = 183
31+133+183 = 347

D-deck: 49 rooms: 11 single-berth, all of which could be fitted with an upper Pullman-berth. Six 2-berth and Thirty-two 3-berth
= 11+11+12+96 = 130

E-deck: Old 1st Class: 45 rooms: 11 single-berth, all of which could be fitted with an upper Pullman-berth. Two 2-berth; twenty-eight 3-berth and four 4-berth
= 11+11+4+84+16 = 126

Ex-2nd Class: 46 rooms: 9 single-berth, all of which could be fitted with an upper Pullman-berth. Thirty-seven 3-berth. = 9+9+111 = 129

905+129 = 1034. So the figures you knew about excluded rooms that had been 2nd Class; while the set of figures I knew about included those rooms. The one niggling question is the Servant's rooms on B-deck. Were they originally for 2 and re-defined as single-berth; or did they remain as 2-berth; with a sofa-berth or like B-5 and B-6 have an upper-berth?

Perhaps I should also do 2nd and 3rd Class?

Regards,
Lester
 
Jul 9, 2000
58,620
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Easley South Carolina
>>Perhaps I should also do 2nd and 3rd Class?<<

Whew! If you have the eyes for it. Not sure I could do it without my vision going fuzzy followed by my passing out!

I take it some of the accomadations in 2cnd Class could be used for 1st if things were tight and the market was there.
 
Jul 20, 2000
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Hi Michael,

First a minor correction. 135 [not 131] rooms on C-deck.

Rooms E-43 to E-88 were originally 2nd Class; then became 1st or 2nd Class. I had understood that they were designated as 1st Class on Titanic, but I now understand they could still have been 2nd Class. - In fact rooms E-1 to E-42 although designated as 1st Class could also be 2nd Class; leaving only rooms E-200 to E-203 [the 4 inside 4-berth rooms which could be accessed by the forward staircase from D-deck] as 1st Class. That would reduce 905 by 110.

All that just as my head was clearing and my vision was coming back.
Regards,
Lester
 

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