$300000000 in Diamonds

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I need some help with this one as age is a key factor in my memory, but....

Didn't we discuss the diamonds in another thread someplace and that someone was recovered with the diamonds sown into his coat?

Just an inkling,

Beverly
 
As for a contemporaneous mention of diamonds, there was a mention in the New York Times of such a loss, April 16 or 17, 1912.

"In addition to a valuable shipment of diamonds which was said to be aboard Titanic, ..."

But, of course, the registered mail was supposedly bought up on deck - and would have floated off, ultimately sinking only God knows where.
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Truth or the Syrens' Call, visit: RMS Republic
 

Joshua Doyle Tift

Former Member
How does any one know for certain. I have read in a book that the diamonds belonged to two brothers in steerage who were going to cash in on them in the U.S. Poeple may have been quite at the time for fear that every one would go nuts trying to find the ship and the gems. So dont allways assume that there is nothing to find until you have marked off everything you could think of.
 
>>I have read in a book that the diamonds belonged to two brothers in steerage who were going to cash in on them in the U.S.<<

And that book would be?

And the primary source cited by that book to support it's claims would be???

>>So dont allways assume that there is nothing to find until you have marked off everything you could think of.<<

Don't always assume that there is either. Shipwrecks that achieve notoriaty are breeding grounds for tales like this, and they have a habit of "improving" with the telling, but they are not always supported by reality. Having said that much, Titanic could very well have been carrying such things. However, any such shipments would have been handled with great discretion for security reasons.
 

Joshua Doyle Tift

Former Member
My source would be the book TITANIC WOMAN AND CHILDREN FIRST. By Judith B. Geller so there is your SOURCE!!! She talks about the Billiard brothers who were diamond miners. Also read the books TITANIC The Great Lakes Connections by Cris Kohl and Titanic An Illustrated History. The gems may be in the safe still or in his room. Other shipments of diamonds would of course been shipped secretly but why all the talk about it if it was not true. History has a way of letting its secrets out slowly.
 
Mr. Tift,
the general tone of your posts is rather aggressive and confrontational. Please read the forum rules, and treat others with respect. Many people here have undertaken considerable, verifiable, and published research in many fields, and do not need to be told rather rudely to read books which I am quite certain they know all about.

Paul's question to you is quite right and, to expand on what he and Michael are saying -
primary sources are supporting documentation or verbal testimony from the time of the voyage / aftermath. So, insurance documents, tickets, manifests, evidence to the US or British Inquiries etc. are primary sources. You could also use written eyewitness accounts of the sinking like Lawrence Beesley's. Newspaper articles embroidered, or even simply made up, by sensation-hungry journalists are not reliable, neither is hearsay gossip surfacing sometimes years after the event. Anyone is entitled to write a book about any aspect of the Titanic, and everyone else is entitled to be skeptical if the author cannot support their argument with references to primary sources. That is the point both Michael and Paul were making to you.

I think everyone agrees there might have been some good jewellery on board, but they do not believe it is either reliably documented, or that it could be recovered without great difficulty and uncertainty.
 
>>My source would be the book TITANIC WOMAN AND CHILDREN FIRST. By Judith B. Geller so there is your SOURCE!!! <<

Speaking strictly as a moderator...cool it.

The agressive and confrontational tone of your posts that Monica pointed to don't make your case and may very well drive off people who may otherwise be willing to help you out in finding the real history.

Now, moderator's hat off and speaking strictly from one interested member to another, I'm familier with the books you mentioned and even have my own copies. While I'm sure the authors did the best they could, their works are not without their errors. When asking for a source, the best possible source you can provide is a primary source of the sort that Monica mentioned.

Is there any such to back up the claims made by Ms. Geller or Mr. Kohl? If not, be cautious. They may well be repeating the mythos as opposed to the reality without even knowing it.
 
It seems there were quite a few articles about valuable gems on the ship. Along with the two posted above, I found on my trip to Philadelphia an article in the Philadelphia Public Ledger, April 17, 1912:

TITANIC CARRIED $5,000,000 GEMS
------------------
Diamonds consigned to New York Importers
in Mail Bags
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OWNERS WILL LOSE HEAVILY
 

Inger Sheil

Member
Many thanks for posting that, Rosanne - it certainly gives an indication of what rumours were circulating at the time.

Sounds like your trip to Philadelphia was quite a success!

~ Ing
 
>>I still believe more of what Mr.and Mrs. Geller have to say rather than what the papers have to say about the subject.<<

Why?

They're no closer to the problem then the people who wrote those newspaper articles and in reality are a lot further removed. What are their sources and what makes them more reliable. Questioning this sort of thing is part and parcel to critical thinking and good research. They may well be onto something, but I want to see something more credible then "Arnie and Judith Geller sez it."
 

Joshua Doyle Tift

Former Member
Why because Mr. Geller is part owner of the wreck and of course he knows more of what is going on than that of the newspapers.Their sources are the people in which they work with and have studied the wreck and other sources to deal with it, unlike the newspapers.So with that they are closer to the problem.
 
>>Why because Mr. Geller is part owner of the wreck <<

No he isn't. The corperation he's the CEO of...RMS Titanic Inc. is the Salvor in possesion, not the owner. Even if he was the owner, this is hardly proof that he knows what's aboard anymore then qualified historians who have gone over the manifests. Your answer is a non-sequiter.

>>and of course he knows more of what is going on than that of the newspapers<<

Not necceserily.

>>Their sources are the people in which they work with and have studied the wreck and other sources to deal with it, unlike the newspapers.So with that they are closer to the problem.<<

Not nessecerily. What are his sources and what makes them better then the family members and survivors that historians have interviewed over the years as well as the court documents gone over by same? What is there to indicate that they may not be buying into some tall tales and family legends that have been spun?

Remember, just because somebody claims something is there does not mean they're being truthful about it. Being wealthy doesn't mean any of these people are above attempts at insurance fraud.
 
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