All Lifeboats to Carpathia Starboard?


TriHull

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It is my understanding that Captain Rostron picked up the first arriving Titanic lifeboat on the starboard side of the Carpathia (British Inquiry 25401).

I have two questions:

(1) Did all lifeboats approach (and survivors disembark) at Carpathia's starboard side?

(2) Considering Carpathia's turn to avoid an iceberg just prior to reaching that first lifeboat (25401), would the bow of the Carpathia, as it was loading the survivors, now be facing in a westerly direction? Perhaps a WSW direction?

Thank you.
 

Harland Duzen

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To answer your 1st question, not all the lifeboats disembarked on the Starboard side, some also disembarked on the Port side.

Lifeboat 13 was originally off Carpathia's Port Bow when it arrived, but the survivors rowed it across her bow to the Starboard side and disembarked there.

Hope this helps.
 

TriHull

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Great. Thank you, Harland.

Has anyone mapped out which lifeboats arrived on which side of the Carpathia?

Thank you.
 

Harland Duzen

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in terms of mapping the rescue site, I don't know if anyone has tried to, but I'm currently trying to map it, but not without much success yet.
 

TriHull

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Great. Thank you both.

Yes, what I mean by mapped out is: Has anyone recorded which lifeboat went to which side?

Just a simple list:

Port (lee side): 13,
Starboard: 2, 8
Unknown:

I just read yesterday that the lifeboat which Mr. Washington Dodge was on (number 13) went to the port side of Carpathia and that the survivors in Countess of Rothes' lifeboat (number 8) were too tired to go to Carpathia's lee side. I believe that the lee side was port side.

Ioannis, do you know which lifeboats actually did report it?
 
Mar 18, 2008
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I just read yesterday that the lifeboat which Mr. Washington Dodge was on (number 13) went to the port side of Carpathia and that the survivors in Countess of Rothes' lifeboat (number 8) were too tired to go to Carpathia's lee side.

Ioannis, do you know which lifeboats actually did report it?

Do you mean report or mention of "lee side"? That was Woolner in boat No. D. Slooper in No. 7 mentioned that they pulled under the lee of the vessel.
 
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According to this picture this is lifeboat No. 11 with No.14 in rear of the pic. I can't tell but maybe one of the mariners here could identify which side of Carpathia it is. My guess is port side but its only a guess.
620?cb=20150924151923.png

Lifeboat 11
 
May 3, 2005
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It is my understanding t6hat Captain Rostron picked up the first arriving Titanic lifeboat on the starboard side of the Carpathia (British Inquiry 25401).

I have two questions:

(1) Did all lifeboats approach (and survivors disembark) at Carpathia's starboard side?

(2) Considering Carpathia's turn to avoid an iceberg just prior to reaching that first lifeboat (25401), would the bow of the Carpathia, as it was loading the survivors, now be facing in a westerly direction? Perhaps a WSW direction?

Thank you.
(1) From what I have read at least some of the lifeboats approached and survivors disembarked on Carpathia's starboard side, since this was the Lee, or sheltered side, since a breeze or wind had come up.
(2) This ex-navy person who was never a real sailor is unable to speculate so will not make a guess . :-(
 

George Jacub

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Sep 28, 2005
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Hi Steven. I am the author of the article above. I would appreciate it if you would tell me (privately if you want) what is confusing so that I can try to make it clearer. Thanks.
 
Nov 14, 2005
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Hi Steven. I am the author of the article above. I would appreciate it if you would tell me (privately if you want) what is confusing so that I can try to make it clearer. Thanks.
I was having trouble keeping track of all the numbers and letters of the boats. I had to keep strolling up or down to keep the numbers staright in my head. Hence the confusion. But that was more on me not your article. Thats why I said it might be clearer to you all. Some days I read an article and it doesn't click. I can read it another day and it makes perfect sense. I reread your article. Its a good article, I like it. It caused me to go look up more on the life boats. Thanks.
 

George Jacub

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Sep 28, 2005
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Thanks for your reply. I share your frustration at number overload. I will reread the article to see if I can break it up somehow to make it easier to follow.
 
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Your Welcome. I was going to mention it in my other reply but decided not to because I didn't think it was relevant to the discussion. But since you mentioned number overload. Thats exactly right. For the last week I've been looking up part numbers for 2 restoration projects I'm working on. Spending hours on it each day. Gone number blind.
 

TriHull

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Ok, great, thanks everyone. My following post is a little long, but it stays focused (I hope).

Very nice article, Mr Jakub. From that article, Dr Dodge says..."When our boat reached the ship's side we passed in front of her bow, to reach the port side, where we would have the shelter from the wind, and a smoother sea to disembark. An officer of the "Carpathia" called to us to come up on the starboard side. The vessel was then unloading lifeboats on each side Those of us who were rowing endeavored for five minutes to pull back across the bow of the ship, but so ineffective were our efforts, that we were unable against the wind to make any progress. We finally had to disembark on the port side."

Dr Dodge says they were trying to get to the port side for shelter from the wind. Would that mean the port side is the lee side?

An officer told Dodge's boat to go to the starboard, but they could not (because of the wind), so they stayed on the port.

Was the wind coming out of the north?

If Dodge was in 13, then the list in Mr Jakub's article is correct for 13. And it seems that Ioannis is correct with Woolner in D and Slooper in 7 and they pulled to the lee side, which seems to be the port side. Mr Paige, if you can find a source for the starboard side being the lee, let me know. Because it would be nice for all of us to solve this.

This information kind of leads back to my original post's question number 2:
Question (2) Considering Carpathia's turn to avoid an iceberg just prior to reaching that first lifeboat (British Inquiry 25401), which way would the bow of the Carpathia, as it was loading the survivors, now be facing?

By the way, as a means to solve this issue, I am looking at the shadows and/or brightness of the bows of the lifeboats as they approach the Carpathia. There are a few photos online of the lifeboats, but I have also noticed that, unfortunately, some of the negatives have been flipped. I believe that there were three photographers (Barker, Fenwick, Ogden) on Carpathia, so perhaps at least one photographer was on each side of Carpathia.

Mr Christian, in the photo you posted above, I think that lifeboat is facing into the sun, but I am not certain. I base my suspicion on viewing another photo online, which shows an opposite view of your photograph (attached below), where we can see three other lifeboats next to the hull and behind your lifeboat. The three lifeboats are in much more shadow, and seemingly the sky is much more washed out perhaps indicating the sunrise is near there, and it is why I think your lifeboat (11?) is facing the sun. If that is lifeboat 11, Mr Jacub, we can move 11 out of the unknown column of your article and into the starboard. Gentlemen, check to make certain, I might be seeing things and I do not mind if you say I am completely incorrect. Is it possible the photo below of the three boats is facing East or ENE? And note the cutter or lifeboat hanging at the top of the photo. Are we looking forward on the starboard side of Carpathia? (I do not know how the Carpathia's lifeboats were arranged on the ship)

A good shadow indicator is the one photo of a lifeboat being hauled aboard (also attached below) - it is still up in the air, and you can see that the shadow of the sunrise is falling on the boat and on the man next to the lifeboat with his back to the camera. So, in that photo, I believe that the sun would be behind the photographer. But, I do not know how to tell if that lifeboat is being hauled aboard the port or starboard side. Perhaps you guys have a better knowledge of Carpathia or ships in general and will recognize something on deck which would be a clue. Perhaps the shadows on the lifeboats at sea will determine which side they approached. Check it out and see what you think.

Titanic lifeboats at side Horizon.jpg
Titanic lifeboat on Carpathia horizon.jpg
 
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Mar 18, 2008
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This information kind of leads back to my original post's question number 2:
Question (2) Considering Carpathia's turn to avoid an iceberg just prior to reaching that first lifeboat (British Inquiry 25401), which way would the bow of the Carpathia, as it was loading the survivors, now be facing?

By the way, as a means to solve this issue, I am looking at the shadows and/or brightness of the bows of the lifeboats as they approach the Carpathia. There are a few photos online of the lifeboats, but I have also noticed that, unfortunately, some of the negatives have been flipped. I believe that there were three photographers (Barker, Fenwick, Ogden) on Carpathia, so perhaps at least one photographer was on each side of Carpathia.

That question is not easy not answer. From different accounts we have the information that Carpathia did not remain stopped but from time to time was moving towards a lifeboat.

Mr Christian, in the photo you posted above, I think that lifeboat is facing into the sun, but I am not certain. I base my suspicion on viewing another photo online, which shows an opposite view of your photograph (attached below), where we can see three other lifeboats next to the hull and behind your lifeboat. The three lifeboats are in much more shadow, and seemingly the sky is much more washed out perhaps indicating the sunrise is near there, and it is why I think your lifeboat (11?) is facing the sun.

How do you know it is boat No. 11 among the 4 boats?

But, I do not know how to tell if that lifeboat is being hauled aboard the port or starboard side. Perhaps you guys have a better knowledge of Carpathia or ships in general and will recognize something on deck which would be a clue. Perhaps the shadows on the lifeboats at sea will determine which side they approached. Check it out and see what you think.

It is emergency boat No. 2 which is taken here aboard Carpathia on her starboard side of the bow.

Chapter 5 in the book "Titanic in Photograps" has many photographs and some information about the rescue & recovery of the lifeboats. That chapter was mainly written by myself. You will see that I disagree with the lifeboat arriving list in the Centenial book as well with the above list of Mr. Jacub
I do not think I have there the side mentioned but I did mention a few in the longer version I had published in the last part of my lifeboat series (which was published in the magazine of the British & Swiss Society).
 

TriHull

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Thank you, Ioannis. Fantastic information.

From reading testimony (I cannot remember whose), I thought I recalled that the Carpathia was moving about while taking on the survivors.

However, I was hoping we could figure out which way Carpathia faced initially when picking up lifeboat 2. We may never know.

In your post immediately above, you asked "How do you know it is boat No. 11 among the 4 boats?" Well, in post #10 above, it is actually you who said it is lifeboat 11. (Unless I am reading your post incorrectly.) And, in Titanic in Photographs, the book to which you made referral, that same photo is described as lifeboat 11 (page 146).

By the way, I need to read chapter 5 "Tragedy and Rescue" in Titanic in Photographs. I have the book but I have no recollection of reading that chapter, although I surely must have. I notice the authors of that book have extended particular thanks to you for your extensive contribution to that chapter and your meticulous attention to detail. Great job!

Is there anyway to access your lifeboat series from the British & Swiss Societies online?

Thank you.
 
Mar 18, 2008
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Thank you, Ioannis. Fantastic information.

You are welcome!

In your post immediately above, you asked "How do you know it is boat No. 11 among the 4 boats?" Well, in post #10 above, it is actually you who said it is lifeboat 11. (Unless I am reading your post incorrectly.) And, in Titanic in Photographs, the book to which you made referral, that same photo is described as lifeboat 11 (page 146).

I was referring to the one you posted in post #17 with the 4 lifeboats alongside but re reading it, I notice that I get it wrong and thought you was stating that No. 11 is one of the 4 boats in that photo.

By the way, I need to read chapter 5 "Tragedy and Rescue" in Titanic in Photographs. I have the book but I have no recollection of reading that chapter, although I surely must have. I notice the authors of that book have extended particular thanks to you for your extensive contribution to that chapter and your meticulous attention to detail. Great job!

Thanks!
I have helped with the other chapters too, discussing a few things with Daniel Klistorner.

Is there anyway to access your lifeboat series from the British & Swiss Societies online?

I am afraid it is not online. I have wanted to publish it myself somewhere online but haven't done so. (From time to time I am doing a few updates but sadly no much time.)
The Swiss Society has their magazine available on their page as a PDF File. You have to register and then you will get a email with the password to get access to the magazine. The membership is free and so the magazine which you can download.
Kostenlos Mitglied werden
 

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