Attempt to repair the starboardside damage


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Alvin Dusaran

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hi guys,

I'm thinking if officers send out seamen or crew to repair the thought to be a hole that the ship recieved from the collision. The workers who try to weld the hole died from drowning or hypothermia. I don't know if it was only my dream or actually seen this in documentary or film before.

Any clarification?

Thanks,

AlvinD
 
May 5, 2005
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Alvin, sounds like a bad dream. I doubt that kind of repair could have been pulled off in 2011, let alone 1912. That hull was breached all over the first 300' (the length of a football field)
They were overwhelmed from the onset.
 

Jim Currie

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It might have been possible if they had enough tarpaulins. The trick was to tie long guy ropes to each corner of the tarp then weight one of the long sides and lower it over the bow. Men at the two top corners continue to lower the tarp while the men on the two opposite corners walk along the main deck on each side and drag the tarp aft along the outside,bottom of the ship. As the tarp passes over the hole in the the hull plating, the water pressure tries to push it through the hole into the ship. If the guy ropes are kept tight, the hole is effectively plugged. There is some leakage but the pumps then have a better chance to do their work. This was not a particularly skilled operation therefore Titanic would have had enough beefy guys to do the pulling and hauling. Welding was not a shipyard practice in those days. In fact, even after WW2, many ships were still composite built with riveted butts and welded seams.
 
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Williakm Garzke, during one interview at the time of his participation with an RMSTI expedition suggested bed matressing coupled with shoring.

Michael Cundiff
NV, USA
 

Alvin Dusaran

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maybe thats only my dream or possibly done with the other ship, but is it possible to do the repair inside the ship while flooding these days or even before?
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>maybe thats only my dream or possibly done with the other ship, but is it possible to do the repair inside the ship while flooding these days or even before?<<

That's not quite as clear cut as you might think. A lot would depend on the nature and location of the damage as well as the materials and resources available. Diving equipment was non-existant on the Titanic, so that's out. The same applies for much of the material you need for shoring as well as filling in cracks.

The problem here is that the resources I took for granted as being there when or if it was needed either didn't exist in 1912 or there was a poor to non-existant understanding of how it could be used.

In short, what I could fix today wasn't fixable in 1912 or they just didn't conceive of how it could be effectively used.
 

Alvin Dusaran

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hellow Guys,

think it was funny that what I remembered was not a ship, but maybe the documentary film of Chrenobyl, some men where sent out to dive and repair the nuclear reactor pipes in order for it not to mix with water. Maybe I was puzzled because I watched hundreds of different documentary film.

Thanks guys,

AlvinD
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>some men where sent out to dive and repair the nuclear reactor pipes in order for it not to mix with water.<<

Dive where? Chernobyl was a land based and graphite moderated RBMK type reactor. Take a look at the article and schematics in the link. Unless one is a Munchkin among Munchkins, there's nowhere to dive to.

Perhaps you're getting the documentaries confused?

>>They have no ways to repair it because the water pressure is too great.<<

Errrrr...no. They had no way to repair it because they had niether the essential materials, equipment, and training. Patching holes and filling splits or cracks in seams is not a technical impossibility. I've had training to do just that and all sorts of useful stuff available in damage control lockers to do just that.

The Titanic didn't.
 

Alvin Dusaran

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I can't remember if it was just only a tank where underneath of it are pipes connecting through the water bodies connecting to rivers. I remember it says that it is dangerous if the nuclear matter mixed with the water will became explosive or the water outside will be contaminate with radioactive material. they sent out several men to close the pipes or repair it, and none of them returned alive.I forgot to say it was a TV short docu drama.


just confused..


Thank guys,

AlvinD
 
Jul 9, 2000
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I think you'll find that the issue was that the molten core of the reactor would cause any water it came into contact with to flash instantly into steam. The uranium wouldn't become explosive when mixed with water, but that would be little confort to anybody downwind of the radioactive plume of steam going into the air, and then condensing to fall as radioactive rain.
 

Alvin Dusaran

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I think thats the idea of it, i'm not even sure because i haven't review the docu drama, I just watched it on TV once. And I think its impossible to connect the Tank from the water to the rivers that is being used by people. If they dispose the water of the tank in these water bodies it will become the worst disaster in human existance and all people today might be exposed in small amount of Radioactive material that have been dumped.

I wish they really don't, but lately I have read a news that some or I think health organization is pursuing a country because of using nuclear energy and the radioactive waste which I think mixed in the water that possibly exposed huge percentage of people living today. I'm not sure if it is the chernobyl or not.

AlvinD
 
Oct 28, 2000
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Getting back to Titanic, which did not have a nuclear reactor, there is really no practicable way for the ingress to have been staunched by collision mats. These mats were common in wooden naval vessels, but steel ships the size of Titanic had outgrown the technology.

A collision mat is usualy made out of a "fothered" sail. Not many sails in Titanic, nor did the crew have long hours on a six-month passage to fother a sail. This process involved pushing light twine through the weave of the cloth to form a decidedly furry-looking mat. The twine would expand when wet, as would the fabric of the sail, and thus plug the hole.

Collision mats were applied from the outside so that water pressure would hold them in place. Imagine doing this at night on a ship where the waterline is perhaps 45 feet below the weather deck and the damage is another 33 or 34 feet under water. You would have to handle the mat on ropes nearly 100 feet long. The whole idea was quite impracticable.

-- David G. Brown
 

Alvin Dusaran

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hi,

although those repair mentioned above seems to be impracticable, if ever the titanic survive the sinking and stay afloat (considering that she had 3 compartment filled with water or she has the same to britannic with 6 compartment flooded can stay afloat) how would be repair could be done? Do they do it on the middle of atlantic or do they tow the ship? Is it possible to move the ship while its forward section is underwater, i'm just thinking that if titanic try to move itself will add more pressure and the sinking process will become faster, just like what happened on britannic.

AlvinD
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>how would be repair could be done?<<

With the equipment, resources and training available then, about the most they could have done was isolate the damaged compartments and hope they could survive long enough to be towed to port. Any permanent repairs would have to be made in drydock.
 

Alvin Dusaran

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hi,

i think towing titanic to the port until it reached the drydock might be possible. considering that she have 3 compartment filled with water and small holes recieved from impact with iceberg. But how about if the damage was severe such as what happened to britannic. With 6 compartment full and huge hole on her bottom, and ship rose heavily in an angle and consider britannic was in the middle of atlantic and stay afloat.

How the ship could be towed? I'm thinking if pulling ship that has a big hole filled with water will split the forward section to the rest of the ship.

AlvinD
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>But how about if the damage was severe such as what happened to britannic. <<

Then the whole question becomes moot. Any damage which would (And did) kill the Britannic would be non-survivable for the Titanic. There would be no repair, no tow, no drydock.

>>How the ship could be towed? I'm thinking if pulling ship that has a big hole filled with water will split the forward section to the rest of the ship.<<

By attatching the tow lines to the stern. There are as many bitts, cleats, and chocks back there for lines as there are up forward.
 

Alvin Dusaran

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now i get it, that method will distribute all the force not only on the bow but also the entire ship. but do they tow the ship stern first?
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>now i get it, that method will distribute all the force not only on the bow but also the entire ship.<<

Uh...not exactly. The idea behind towing the ship stern first is to relieve the structure of the hydrodynamic stresses of having the damaged section towed through the water.
 
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