Captain Lord and the Californian Please Read


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Jun 26, 2002
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Thanks Don

I am sure there are a million questions in my head, just can not think of them all at the same time.

A lot of what you all are saying I have heard before, but when you hear things in a different context they can seem to mean something completely different, know what I mean?

Melinda
 

Adam McGuirk

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May 19, 2002
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Melinda thanks for the compliment......actu ally I don't really know a whole lot about Hithens, though I bet some here do, but I think he had some trouble with the law, read his bio, on et. I think he was pretty nasty on that night, only in real life Molly Brown won the battle.
Adam
 
Jun 26, 2002
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Adam

Now wouldn't that be one woman you would have liked to have met, imagine a woman like that back then, a lot of woman don't have her guts even in this day and age.

Melinda
 

Don Tweed

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May 5, 2002
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Melinda,
Yes I do!
That is what makes it so special here.
So many different views on the same subject matter!
Keeps me entertained
happy.gif

-Don
 

Don Tweed

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May 5, 2002
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It was cool to see people almost chatting.
Is there a place where people chat about Titanic?
-Don
 

Mark Baber

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>Is there a place where people chat about Titanic?

#titanic on dalnet, Fridays and Sundays at 9 PM Eastern (US) time, 0100 UTC this time of year.
 
May 12, 2002
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Hi Melinda,

You asked about the sound of the rockets. Well, seeing as I'm doing a little work on that subject, I'll put a little of what I've worked out up here now.

You've been referred to Dave Billnitzer's excellent website already. Unfortunately, one thing he gets wrong is the physics involved of the sound of the rockets. Dave correctly states that sound intensity falls off as the square of the distance. What he misses is that we perceive sound logarithmically. You've heard of the decibel? Well, when the sound intensity drops to 10% of its level, it only looses 10 decibels. Similarly when it drops to 1%, it only looses another 10 decibels (a total of 20 now). For the record, there's some more complications involving the fact that low frequency sounds (like a rocket boom) don't travel well over flat surfaces (like the mirror flat sea that night).

To work out how loud the rockets were 10 miles away (for the sake of argument), we also need to know how loud they are at some other distance. Dave gives a figure of 125 dB for rockets, but with no indication of the distance from the rocket. I've done some preliminary calculations based on the sound of some pretty loud fireworks that I was observing at a distance of 1 mile.

Anyway enough waffle, onto the numbers. At 10 miles, I get figures of about 30 dB. This is loud enough to hear (it's about a whisper), but there's one more point to consider. Sound takes about 50 seconds to travel 10 miles, so each flash would be followed, nearly a minute later, by a very quiet sound. If the crew of the Californian had been able to link each sound with each rocket, especially with other noises on board, I'd be damn surprised!

So in essence, I believe the sounds would have been audible. The reasons they weren't noted were 1) they were very quiet and 2) they were extremely hard to link to the observed flashes.

That turned out to be quite long! I'm going to put all the details on my website eventually with some decent diagrams to help out.

Cheers

Paul
 

Don Tweed

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Whether it was Titanic firing the rockets or not, shouldnt the Californian have done something?
Lets say for the sake of arguement that it wasnt Titanic firing the fockets but a "mystery" ship in between.
They still should have done something!!!
-Don
 
May 12, 2002
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Hi Don,

You're preaching to the choir in my case! There's no question in my mind that the officers of Californian (not just Lord) should have done much more than they did (waking the wireless operator would have been a start...)

Hi Melinda,

You should note that I'm not an expect in acoustics and atmospherics. There may well be other effects to take into account (for example, the sea contained icebergs and wasn't totally smooth). Still, the numbers shouldn't be too far off.

Cheers

Paul
 
Jan 21, 2001
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Hi Paul:

Can you explain more about what you mean by perceiving sound "logarithmically?" Or do you have a reference I can look at? If so, I will make the necessary mathematical corrections to my site. I guess I am trying to understand how or why we measure the diminishment of sound with inverse squares, but hear it in logarithms.

The bigger point you made, and that I was making, is that whatever sound the rockets made, at ten miles it would not have been the big bang that Lord's defenders misleadingly insist it should have been.

Melinda, you asked up above why Fleet and Lee did not see another ship's lights before the collision, or even until much later. And that's a good question.

I think a more interesting one is this: how did Fleet and Lee *miss* seeing another ship's lights for so long, when officers on the bridge saw them very soon after the collision - right around midnight, or as soon as the men arrived on deck to start turning out the boats?
 
Jun 26, 2002
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Well I honestly didn't think it could be heard even that far, I was expecting about 2 miles being the limit.

Can someone please answer the question of why the lookouts did not see any lights from another ship untill after the collision.

Thank you,
Melinda
 
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