Could a linercruise ship actually be capsized by a rouge wave

[Tarn Stephanos]

In watching the original and remake of 'The 'Poseidon Adventure', I had the nagging feeling in the back of my head that was was depicted in both films was not possible-

I don't think a liner or a cruise ship could be flipped upside down by a rouge wave..It might be rolled on it's side, but with the weight of the ship centered towards its keel, it would right itself...Are there any known instances where a large ship was flipped upside down by a large wave-and remained upside down?

If the QM2 were hit by an enormous tidal wave or tsunami, would the wave flip her upsidedown, in a manner similar to what happened to the ships in the 'Poseidon Adventure'?

regards

tarn Stephanos

 

[Michael H. Standart]

>>Are there any known instances where a large ship was flipped upside down by a large wave-and remained upside down?<<

The Great Lakes is notorious for this sort of thing. Ask David Brown about the White Hurricane of 1913 or better yet, read the book he wrote on the subject. At least one vessel was known to have been rolled over, some were driven on the rocks, and others simply disappeared never to be heard from again.

Don't underestimate the power of oceanic rogue waves either. They were dismissed as legends for the longest time until they were not only observed, but photographed as well. Get one big enough and anything can be rolled over. Some may have, but unfortunately, the vessels that were no doubt effected have gone down in the books as "Lost, Cause Unknown."

 

[Susan Morrison]

The QE2 rode out a huge wave at some time, as I recall. I'm sorry I don't have any further details.

 

[Susan Morrison]

Aha! Found this - sorry it took me so long. In mourning for the Cutty Sark
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-850707.html

 

[monica e. hall]

I saw a program on TV about this a while back. It documented the work of ESA (European Space Agency) into the phenonmenon and it was very interesting. Here is their summary report, and there's an ESA TV link, which might show the only film footage of a couple of ships encountering one.
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMOKQL26WD_index_0.html

 

[monica e. hall]

Did I say a while ago? It was Horizon program from 2002 - must have seen the repeat. Anyway, here's the link to that, which includes an explanation of the calculations of how they might be formed, and the chance to have your own freak wave on your screensaver - a must-have!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/horizon/2002/freakwave.shtml

 

[monica e. hall]

Good one from Wiki. Must stop this - it's getting me nervous about crossing the Bay of Biscay to Spain in a ro-ro ferry this summer ....
http://www.answers.com/topic/rogue-wave-oceanography

 

[Jeremy Aufderheide]

Last night on the History Channel there was an hour-long show devoted to rogue waves and their existence. They even suggested that the Edmund Fitzgerald could have been the victim of a rogue wave, given the twisted condition of the wreck.

It was a very interesting show.

 

[Michael H. Standart]

>>They even suggested that the Edmund Fitzgerald could have been the victim of a rogue wave, given the twisted condition of the wreck.<<

They may be overthinking the problem a bit. There's very good reason to believe that the ship allided with some poorly and inaccurately charted rocks which opened the hull to the sea. Had this not happened, I'm betting that the Fitz would have survived the storm which ultimately killed her. As it stands, it's very likely that the waves that most likely did the ship in were the very same waves that the Arthur Anderson were hit with and passed on a warning about. Not really rogue waves in the sense that we're talking about, but what Great Lakes sailors know as The Twin Sisters.

 

[monica e. hall]

The news has just reported on the Cutty Sark. Seems like she was being renovated and her fittings, much of her decking, figurehead etc., were all in storage anyway. They're pretty optimistic they can put her back together again (Lottery Commissioners will be sighing and reaching into their fund). They think it was probably arson, given that no workmen had been on her since Friday, and no electrical equipment was connected up. Odd people about, if it's true.

 

[João Carlos Pereira Martins]

Was the great lake steamer «Regina», that sank in the referred 1913's hurricane, turned upside down by a rogue wave? I remind watching the dive to its wreck on the History Channel, but I can't remember the sinking cause. Does anybody know? I believe there was no survivors.

Best,
JC

 

[Denise A. Hunyadi]

quote:

Not really rogue waves in the sense that we're talking about, but what Great Lakes sailors know as The Twin Sisters.

It's actually three waves, Mike! On page 47 of White Hurricane, Dave Brown's terrific book about the Great Storm of 1913, he describes the "Three Sisters" as "a trio of so-called rogue waves that appear suddenly, ravage unsuspecting ships, and then disappear."

As for the Regina, she was a small package freighter that had taken on a full load of various cargo before heading out into Lake Huron, including a deck load of iron pipe that extended above her railings. This load undoubtedly made her top heavy as she headed out into the stormy lake and led to her demise.

There was one freighter that rolled over during the storm and stayed afloat, exposing her underside. For a time this unidentified boat was known as the "Mystery Ship." Some thought it was the Regina, but later it was discovered that it was in fact the Charles S. Price.

Denise​

 

[David G. Brown]

Joao--

During the "White Hurricane" on Lake Huron in 1912 Regina departed Sarnia upbound with a load of pipe on deck. The ship apparently got at least 2/3rds of the way up Lake Huron, then turned around, probably because the storm seemed worse in the northern part of the lake. Captain McConkey had no way to know his location other than a good guess.

Regina bumped bottom near Harbor Beach, Michigan and began taking on water. The sprung plating from striking the bottom is still visible. Rather than fight the storm, McConkey decided to anchore, and did. The ship's anchor is still deeply buried in the bottom and the chain is still bar-tight.

Nobody knows why, but the crew elected to abandon ship. They got away in small boats, one of which washed ashore in Canada with a crew of frozen bodies. Captain McConkey stayed on the ship, apparently in his cabin. His body came ashore the following year.

Regina rolled over as it sank, probably under the combined weight of deck ice and that load of pipe. The water is too shallow for the ship to roll back upright after it foundered.

--David G. Brown

 

[Michael H. Standart]

Point taken on the Three Sisters, Denise, and it's a good bet that they've been behind a lot of Mysterious Disappearances on the Great Lakes.

 

[Jeremy Aufderheide]

I wasn't really buying the conclusion on the Fitz, Michael. Just relaying information.

From the doc, however, it looks like rogue waves exist more frequently than previously thought. They showed sinkings and damage to ships and first-hand accounts which were pretty convincing.

So, I'd be inclined to believe the validity of the 06 remake's rogue wave better than the tidal wave of the original. I believe I read that tidal waves aren't visible in deep ocean, only when the surge of water is at a shallow enough depth to hit bottom and therefore push the water higher making the wave larger.