Bob Godfrey
Member
Perfumes have been available for thousands of years and there was a huge range on the market in 1912, along with soaps, shampoos, talc, toothpaste etc. Shaving soap was in common use, but the 'aftershave' treatments of the period were generally not made specifically for that purpose, like Eau de Cologne. Anti-perspirants are a quite modern concept, but deodorants (which mask odors rather than preventing the cause) are as old as perfume itself. The first commercial deodorant (Mum) had been on the market for 20 years. All these things cost money, though, so most people would have relied on including the underarm area in their daily morning wash.
Bob Godfrey
Member
If you mean deodorant, the point I've already made is that most people didn't use it at all. Most of us today have been brainwashed by advertisers who want us to believe that all sorts of perfectly natural things (like dandruff, 'BO' etc) are un-natural or even symptoms of disease. Sweat actually has little or no odour, so the cheapest alternative is to wash it off regularly before bacteria (the real culprits) get to work on it. And cheap alternatives were more necessary then than now. Keep in mind that while few people had access to showers and most didn't climb into a bathtub more than once a week they did have the opportunity to wash regularly and quite thoroughly - though not all took that opportunity!
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monica e. hall
Member
I vaguely recall something unattractively called a "sweat pad" from my extreme youth. It was attached to a dress etc. by poppers under the arm, and could be detached and washed frequently, thus saving having to do difficult laundry (in those days) on the garment itself on a regular basis.
Those people having a daily wash instead of using deodorant were probably better off, if the purpose of deodorant is to mask odours. What's the point of thrashing out ££s / $$s on Chanel No. 5 if it's going to have to compete with Mum Rose - which is not pleasant, and distinctly cheap. And it's probably not a good idea to spray aluminum-based anti-perspirants all over yourself on a daily basis now, either.
Those people having a daily wash instead of using deodorant were probably better off, if the purpose of deodorant is to mask odours. What's the point of thrashing out ££s / $$s on Chanel No. 5 if it's going to have to compete with Mum Rose - which is not pleasant, and distinctly cheap. And it's probably not a good idea to spray aluminum-based anti-perspirants all over yourself on a daily basis now, either.
Jim Kalafus
Member
Aimed at the working class, and sold thru august periodicals like National Police Gazette, was Zedonia, an underarm cream application, .05 per bottle. That dates to at least 1892.
I don't know how long it took for concern about body odor to travel upward thru the class system but, in the U.S. at least, very effective "You smell and you offend" adverts were running in what would one day be called The Tabloids as early as the 1880s.
I don't know how long it took for concern about body odor to travel upward thru the class system but, in the U.S. at least, very effective "You smell and you offend" adverts were running in what would one day be called The Tabloids as early as the 1880s.
Bob Godfrey
Member
I imagine that early campaigns to encourage the use of such products would have been aimed mainly at those with aspirations to elevate themselves to the lower middle class, like shop girls and clerks. Certainly in the UK (where wage levels were lower) this sort of marketing had made less progress. And, as Aussies are often keen to point out, it's possibly still got some way to go! "Jeez, I need a beer. I'm dry as a Pom's towel"
Stanley C Jenkins
Member
Sweat pads were, as I understand it, normally referred-to as "dress protectors". Scouting for Boys (unfortunate title?), by Robert Baden Powell, contains several references to the need for regular and careful washing of clothes and bodies - to the Victorians, "cleanliness was next to Godliness".
David G. Brown
RIP
My grandmother was 16 at the time of Titanic and she lived another 73 years. Late in her life I asked her what was the most important invention during her lifetime. Of course, I expected to hear something like "electricity" or "the telephone." She thought for a moment, then got an almost embarrassed look. "Why, it was deodorant," she said. "Without doubt, deodorant."
-- David G. Brown
-- David G. Brown
monica e. hall
Member
We girls are so frivolous, David! My son once asked me the same question, and I instantly replied "Non-smudge, long-lasting lipstick", and I don't even wear it. But I do remember what a problem the old-fashioned greasy stuff was - on cups, food, guys' faces, collars, pillows etc., and the endless 'touching-up'.
On a less exotic, but probably equally frivolous note, I think possibly the dishwasher in my lifetime. No, that's stupid. The computer. My dishwasher is broken at the moment, and I manage perfectly well. When the satellite serving the supermarket went down, they couldn't even open the tills, even if they'd known the prices, which they didn't, never mind let anyone buy anything. How fragile is our modern world?
On a less exotic, but probably equally frivolous note, I think possibly the dishwasher in my lifetime. No, that's stupid. The computer. My dishwasher is broken at the moment, and I manage perfectly well. When the satellite serving the supermarket went down, they couldn't even open the tills, even if they'd known the prices, which they didn't, never mind let anyone buy anything. How fragile is our modern world?
Jim Kalafus
Member
>"Why, it was deodorant," she said. "Without doubt, deodorant."
Yes. If you are old enough to recall how vile The Flower Children smelled...particularly when they slathered themselves with patchouli oil in lieu of showering...or if you were ever in a NYC cab with a vibe ripened driver, before the new "culturally insensitive" regulations went into effect, you can appreciate the wisdom of that.
>I imagine that early campaigns to encourage the use of such products would have been aimed mainly at those with aspirations to elevate themselves to the lower middle class..
No. To be blunt it was aimed at guys who wanted to get laid. The ads for Zedonia, with its promise of "Smelly Armpits Cured" ran side by side with "No Woman wants a WEAK Man- Certain Organs Enlarged" ads in the National Police Gazette.
Womens Mag ads sections of the era were filled with "Miracle Cures," most of which contained Tansy... or natural ...substances which...if you drank half the bottle...would cause you to abort. Or die. Or abort THEN die.
Lots of adverts for...uh...products that "Gently Gave A Woman Grecian Smoothness." That is to say, full-body hair removing gels. They worked. Check out the Taschen Press' new volume of thousands of antique nude images for examples of how early the taboo against female body hair began..."The Beauty of a Grecian Statue", etc.... but one suspects that they were probably caustic. A gel with lye in it would be my guess.
So...men woried about smelly armpits and small...personalities. Women worried about excess body hir and unwanted pregnancies.
The common factor that joined our Victorian Era ancestors? The thread which runs through the adverts in the American working class male AND female "Low Press?"
YOUR BREATH OFFENDS.
Yes, on top of smelly armpits, small organs, hairy forearms and unwanted pregnancy, was the CLASSIC villain. Bad breath. YOU can't smell it...you have no idea....but the entire world draws back at your approach. You are doomed to die a virgin, EVEN if you can get past the small organ/hairy armpits problems, because your breath will doom the deal.
You are evil.
We can help.
One progressive/nonprogressive ad from 1925, a favorite of mine, targets professional women. YOU ARE IN A MANS WORLD MAKING YOUR OWN WAY ON YOUR OWN TERMS blares the banner. Great so far. YOU CANNOT LET 'OLD FASHIONED' FEMALE WORRIES HINDER YOU. Again. Good message. Then, it veers off into the stratosphere explaining that you cannot POSSIBLY do your job well if A) you worry about odors emanating from your privates, or B) far worse, your coworkers worry about them and begin shunning you. The solution? A "Doctor recommended" dilution of Lysol.
>and the endless 'touching-up'.
Which, of course, was a euphemism for "Let's go into the bathroom and talk about what jackasses our dates are, and how quickly we can lose them."
Yes. If you are old enough to recall how vile The Flower Children smelled...particularly when they slathered themselves with patchouli oil in lieu of showering...or if you were ever in a NYC cab with a vibe ripened driver, before the new "culturally insensitive" regulations went into effect, you can appreciate the wisdom of that.
>I imagine that early campaigns to encourage the use of such products would have been aimed mainly at those with aspirations to elevate themselves to the lower middle class..
No. To be blunt it was aimed at guys who wanted to get laid. The ads for Zedonia, with its promise of "Smelly Armpits Cured" ran side by side with "No Woman wants a WEAK Man- Certain Organs Enlarged" ads in the National Police Gazette.
Womens Mag ads sections of the era were filled with "Miracle Cures," most of which contained Tansy... or natural ...substances which...if you drank half the bottle...would cause you to abort. Or die. Or abort THEN die.
Lots of adverts for...uh...products that "Gently Gave A Woman Grecian Smoothness." That is to say, full-body hair removing gels. They worked. Check out the Taschen Press' new volume of thousands of antique nude images for examples of how early the taboo against female body hair began..."The Beauty of a Grecian Statue", etc.... but one suspects that they were probably caustic. A gel with lye in it would be my guess.
So...men woried about smelly armpits and small...personalities. Women worried about excess body hir and unwanted pregnancies.
The common factor that joined our Victorian Era ancestors? The thread which runs through the adverts in the American working class male AND female "Low Press?"
YOUR BREATH OFFENDS.
Yes, on top of smelly armpits, small organs, hairy forearms and unwanted pregnancy, was the CLASSIC villain. Bad breath. YOU can't smell it...you have no idea....but the entire world draws back at your approach. You are doomed to die a virgin, EVEN if you can get past the small organ/hairy armpits problems, because your breath will doom the deal.
You are evil.
We can help.
One progressive/nonprogressive ad from 1925, a favorite of mine, targets professional women. YOU ARE IN A MANS WORLD MAKING YOUR OWN WAY ON YOUR OWN TERMS blares the banner. Great so far. YOU CANNOT LET 'OLD FASHIONED' FEMALE WORRIES HINDER YOU. Again. Good message. Then, it veers off into the stratosphere explaining that you cannot POSSIBLY do your job well if A) you worry about odors emanating from your privates, or B) far worse, your coworkers worry about them and begin shunning you. The solution? A "Doctor recommended" dilution of Lysol.
>and the endless 'touching-up'.
Which, of course, was a euphemism for "Let's go into the bathroom and talk about what jackasses our dates are, and how quickly we can lose them."
Bob Godfrey
Member
All too sophisticated for the UK public in 1912, Jim. Our ads hawked the bird-pulling power of hair restorers, flatter ears, a manly physique, male corsets and a fine new set of second hand teeth. And we knew of course that a large appendage always impressed if it was a moustache.
monica e. hall
Member
"If you are old enough to recall how vile The Flower Children smelled...particularly when they slathered themselves with patchouli oil in lieu of showering..."
Do you mind, Jim! I am old enough to remember this, and also old enough to know I eschewed the vile patchouli oil and embraced showering. But I do remember men at the time slathering themselves in "the great smell of Brut" - don't know what you called it in the USA but it must have been there, permeating society. C'mon now, Bob, confess - did you once use Brut?
I don't think, Jim, adverts aimed at women have changed a lot really, except the solutions are more now high-tech. I have recently squirmed on the sofa watching an advert which warns against a vaguely-phrased form of incontinence, usually afflicting ladies in their 70s, and featuring lovely women in their 30s leaping around and forging careers ... thanks to (I think, I didn't pay much attention - Tenalady). Having a classical education, I think the "Tena" bit is something to do with "holding". I don't like to contemplate it much further.
Now, Stanley. Scouting for Boys was brilliantly revealed to us by Ian Hislop on TV not long ago, and the cold showers and hygiene you mention seem to have been a result of his obsession with what he called 'beastliness'. Oh dear. More poor children worried, but on the other hand, many more children had loads of fun. Hard to balance it out really.
Do you mind, Jim! I am old enough to remember this, and also old enough to know I eschewed the vile patchouli oil and embraced showering. But I do remember men at the time slathering themselves in "the great smell of Brut" - don't know what you called it in the USA but it must have been there, permeating society. C'mon now, Bob, confess - did you once use Brut?
I don't think, Jim, adverts aimed at women have changed a lot really, except the solutions are more now high-tech. I have recently squirmed on the sofa watching an advert which warns against a vaguely-phrased form of incontinence, usually afflicting ladies in their 70s, and featuring lovely women in their 30s leaping around and forging careers ... thanks to (I think, I didn't pay much attention - Tenalady). Having a classical education, I think the "Tena" bit is something to do with "holding". I don't like to contemplate it much further.
Now, Stanley. Scouting for Boys was brilliantly revealed to us by Ian Hislop on TV not long ago, and the cold showers and hygiene you mention seem to have been a result of his obsession with what he called 'beastliness'. Oh dear. More poor children worried, but on the other hand, many more children had loads of fun. Hard to balance it out really.
Jim Kalafus
Member
>a large appendage always impressed if it was a moustache.
Not on a woman.
Back later to expand on this topic.
Not on a woman.
Back later to expand on this topic.
Bob Godfrey
Member
Well, Mon, I do recall once receiving a small bottle of Brut Aftershave at Christmas. Which puzzled me as I had a beard. Maybe somebody was dropping a hint. Do your remember Hai Karate aftershave? Their commercials at least displayed a sense of humour - from nerd to adonis in one easy step. "Be careful how you use it".
What always impressed me in those ads with little comic strips is how the advice to use Lifebuoy soap or whatever was always followed by a transformation of lifestyle equalled only by the winners of lottery jackpots.
What always impressed me in those ads with little comic strips is how the advice to use Lifebuoy soap or whatever was always followed by a transformation of lifestyle equalled only by the winners of lottery jackpots.
