Direction of Funnels Collapsing


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Aaron_2016

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Does anyone know which direction all of the funnels collapsed and if they fell in different directions? Some survivors support a port side collapse, while other's support a starboard side collapse. Perhaps the wreck might hold some clues as the remains of each funnel might show signs of compression on one side and tears on the other. e.g.


The base of the forward funnel


funnel1a.png



The base appears to be compressed on the port side and in front, while remaining intact on the starboard side and behind. This could mean the funnel fell over to port in this direction.


funnel1b.png



The second funnel looks more chaotic.


funnel2a.png


I understand Mr. Thayer believed the 2nd funnel appeared to lift off as if blown upwards by a terrific force and then fell towards him on the starboard side. Although it might be harder to detect which side this funnel fell because it may have struck the water which softened its impact against the deck, and signs of damage may have been reduced upon impact.

Very little is known of the third funnel, and the fourth funnel was claimed by one survivor to have fallen backwards after the ship had broken in two. What are your thoughts on the direction the funnels fell?


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Kyle Naber

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I think all of the funnels fell over to port (the tops of the funnels anyway): the direction the ship was listing towards.

The first funnel’s base was crushed from the water pressure and the top swung out to port, the bottom remaining still.

The second funnel’s base swung out to starboard, the top falling almost straight down, making the funnel face port when it fully collapsed.

The third and fourth funnel fell almost in synch with each other after the stern settled back and listed to port. This was most likely due to the momentum of the funnels following the list of the ship, wanting to continue to fall, making the cables snap and the funnels in turn collapsing onto the port decks and into the water.
 
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Aaron_2016

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I think all of the funnels fell over to port (the tops of the funnels anyway): the direction the ship was listing towards.

The first funnel’s base was crushed from the water pressure and the top swung out to port, the bottom remaining still.

The second funnel’s base swung out to starboard, the top falling almost straight down, making the funnel face port when it fully collapsed.

The third and fourth funnel fell almost in synch with each other after the stern settled back and listed to port. This was most likely due to the momentum of the funnels following the list of the ship, wanting to continue to fall, making the cables snap and the funnels in turn collapsing onto the port decks and into the water.
The damage to the shaft of the first funnel does appear to indicate it fell over to port. It is odd however that Lightoller believed it fell to starboard. He had just been released to the surface. Could he have mistaken it for a different funnel? He said:

"The terrific strain of bringing the after end of that huge hull clear out of the water caused the expansion joint abaft number 1 funnel to open up. The fact that the two wire stays to this funnel on the after part led over and abaft the expansion joint, threw on them an extraordinary strain, eventually carrying away the port wire guy, to be followed almost immediately by the starboard one. Instantly the port one parted, the funnel started to fall, but the fact that the starboard one held a moment or two longer, gave this huge structure a pull over to that side of the ship."


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Kyle Naber

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The damage to the shaft of the first funnel does appear to indicate it fell over to port. It is odd however that Lightoller believed it fell to starboard. He had just been released to the surface. Could he have mistaken it for a different funnel? He said:

"The terrific strain of bringing the after end of that huge hull clear out of the water caused the expansion joint abaft number 1 funnel to open up. The fact that the two wire stays to this funnel on the after part led over and abaft the expansion joint, threw on them an extraordinary strain, eventually carrying away the port wire guy, to be followed almost immediately by the starboard one. Instantly the port one parted, the funnel started to fall, but the fact that the starboard one held a moment or two longer, gave this huge structure a pull over to that side of the ship."


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I highly doubt that he saw all of that. He was most likely making an explanation as to why it failed.

I’m not sure why he said it fell to starboard. It’s possible that he witnessed the base of one of the funnels swung out to starboard, or he could simply have mixed it up in all the chaos.
 
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Aaron_2016

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I highly doubt that he saw all of that. He was most likely making an explanation as to why it failed.

I’m not sure why he said it fell to starboard. It’s possible that he witnessed the base of one of the funnels swung out to starboard, or he could simply have mixed it up in all the chaos.

Thanks. Richard William witnessed his father killed by one of the funnels. He wrote - "The water was almost up to our waists and the ship was about at her last. Suddenly one of the great funnels fell. I sprang, endeavoring to pull my father with me. The funnel was swept overboard and my father’s body went with it."

I wonder what he meant when he said the funnel was "swept overboard". Did he mean it fell on the deck and then rolled or swept overboard afterwards? Colonel Gracie shared Mr. Lightoller's opinion that the forward funnel fell to starboard. The Colonel wrote - "The undisputed facts that there was very little suction and that the forward funnel broke from the ship falling on the starboard side into the sea." It is strange that he said it was an undisputed fact meaning beyond all doubt. Although he followed on to mention Mr. Thayer's escape as he narrowly avoided a funnel falling towards him on the starboard side. Perhaps the Colonel assumed Mr. Thayer was talking about the first funnel and he used his account as proof?


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coal eater

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from looking at damage around area of second funnel most likely it has fallen backwards then rolled on deck and slip into water there is more damage to starboard than portside so it must have hit the backward then roll down on starboard side damaging deck then roll into water
 
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Cam Houseman

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Does anyone know which direction all of the funnels collapsed and if they fell in different directions? Some survivors support a port side collapse, while other's support a starboard side collapse. Perhaps the wreck might hold some clues as the remains of each funnel might show signs of compression on one side and tears on the other. e.g.


The base of the forward funnel


View attachment 42457


The base appears to be compressed on the port side and in front, while remaining intact on the starboard side and behind. This could mean the funnel fell over to port in this direction.


View attachment 42458


The second funnel looks more chaotic.


View attachment 42459

I understand Mr. Thayer believed the 2nd funnel appeared to lift off as if blown upwards by a terrific force and then fell towards him on the starboard side. Although it might be harder to detect which side this funnel fell because it may have struck the water which softened its impact against the deck, and signs of damage may have been reduced upon impact.

Very little is known of the third funnel, and the fourth funnel was claimed by one survivor to have fallen backwards after the ship had broken in two. What are your thoughts on the direction the funnels fell?


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I see what you mean. The "explosion" looks like it happened on the Port side. (maybe) The Fan trunk vent looks gone. Seems like it blown at the top, because the walls encompassing the Second Funnel's uptake are intact. Maybe that's responsible for the Reading and Writing room's destruction. Only this is, the area around the First and Second uptakes/were more intact, shown by the '87 mosaic. And, for some reason, the deck is pulled upwards in the direction of the Funnel falling to Port, not starboard..
 

Cam Houseman

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That's a very good question.

You see, both the Port and Starboard Bridge Wings were intact, at least some of it, in '85 and '86.
Shown and circled in red here on the 1986 wreck mosaic:
1600279800872.png

Circled on Ken Marschall's Painting:
1600279924380.png

Even the bulwark, which is the white, shoulder high "rail" was there in the early years of Titanic's discovery. The Boat Deck was majorly intact. So, I don't think the falling First Funnel hit either.

However, in the 35 years, she's deteriorated in a big way.
Here's the 1986 mosaic again. Outlined are the Bridge wings, and the second Funnel and Gymnasium
1600280502638.png

Now here is the 2010 mosaic:
1600280976197.png

Much of it is gone. So is the forward boat deck.
Does this answer your question?
 

Auden G Minor

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Yes. So what your
That's a very good question.

You see, both the Port and Starboard Bridge Wings were intact, at least some of it, in '85 and '86.
Shown and circled in red here on the 1986 wreck mosaic:
View attachment 49940
Circled on Ken Marschall's Painting:
View attachment 49941
Even the bulwark, which is the white, shoulder high "rail" was there in the early years of Titanic's discovery. The Boat Deck was majorly intact. So, I don't think the falling First Funnel hit either.

However, in the 35 years, she's deteriorated in a big way.
Here's the 1986 mosaic again. Outlined are the Bridge wings, and the second Funnel and Gymnasium
View attachment 49942
Now here is the 2010 mosaic:
View attachment 49943
Much of it is gone. So is the forward boat deck.
Does this answer your question?
Yes. So your saying that the funnel fell over to port. Am I correct?
 
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Auden G Minor

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no, I'm just saying that its hard to tell, especially on the wreck today.
That is true! I think it fell to starboard. That would explain Murdoch looking lifeless (this was said by Lightholler I think.) and also shed some truth of the survivor accounts that said it fell starboard.
 
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Kyle Naber

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I just wonder how the port list would have evened out and even took on a small starboard list. Britannic sank with a starboard list for the entire sinking and it worsened at the end. Obviously the damage and design of the ships were different, but I often wonder that. I feel like the first funnel fell mostly forward more than anything.
 
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Cam Houseman

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I just wonder how the port list would have evened out and even took on a small starboard list. Britannic sank with a starboard list for the entire sinking and it worsened at the end. Obviously the damage and design of the ships were different, but I often wonder that. I feel like the first funnel fell mostly forward more than anything.
Probably smashing the bridge a bit, then the falling mast completed the job.
 

Auden G Minor

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Probably smashing the bridge a bit, then the falling mast completed the job.
Well there it did not. If you look in front of where the funnel last was there is a wall there that is still up (credit to TA's live stream for pointing this out to me) the wall is in front of the funnel. If you want to hear it from TA here is the link:
skip to 23:47 to hear what his proof is.
 
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Cam Houseman

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Well there it did not. If you look in front of where the funnel last was there is a wall there that is still up (credit to TA's live stream for pointing this out to me) the wall is in front of the funnel. If you want to hear it from TA here is the link:
skip to 23:47 to hear what his proof is.
I agree with him. Its just that, if the Funnel did fall to Port, then why was the Number 1 Lifeboat davit and Part of the Bridge Wing still intact?

there's multiple mysteries of Titanic. For example, if she landed, going 20-30 knots into the ocean floor, then why are some dishes still on the tables in the Dining Saloon? Chairs in place?

its unfortunate, there are so many mysteries to her, and the only way we'd know for sure what happened, is to be there.
 
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