Eleanor Cassebeer

R

Randy Bryan Bigham

Member
Phil,

Congrats on your early X-mas gift! I can well imagine your excitement. If anyone can "uncover" the "missing 65" it's you and I don't think there's anybody who'll dispute that.

Good going!

Are we still on for mid- Dec? I have unpacked the boxes and also have just had sent me by L's family a bit of a treasure that I'll not disclose yet but wait to regale you with when we meet.

All the very best to you in your great and inspiring work. And happy thanksgiving to you and yours!

Randy
 
M

Mark Baber

Staff member
Moderator
Member
Hey, Phil---

Great news!! Congrats, OM!

Best wishes.

MAB
 
Kritina Johnston

Kritina Johnston

Member
If someone here could find out more about Jack Phillips, then I'd give them as much Guinness as money could buy.

And Mr. Gowan, congratulations on your discovery of Mrs. Casbah (ooops, Cassebeer).
 
S

Susan Markowitz

Guest
Oh, no, Tracy; it would have been Cashbar (at our gathering in NY), but an angel by the name of Mark picked up the tab instead. :)

Seriously, tho, compliments and congratulations to our Researcher-Par-Excellence, Phil G. -- or should I say, "Titanic" Holmes? That was a remarkable piece of sleuthery. But then, so much of what you've accomplished fits in the "remarkable" category, that I'm afraid we're getting spoiled.

Until I began reading your posts on TML, it seemed to me that the lives of these people, for the most part, started and ended with that voyage. What a shock it was to see dates-of-passing that occurred, in many cases, during my lifetime, and to read of the full lives they led, and the families that survived them. And what a delight to discover that someone else cared about the less-famoous-or-notorious, i.e., the second-and-third-class passengers, the maids and service-people, and the crew.

I keep hoping you'll one day find the time to compile all your findings into a book, so that I don't have to go searching high and low for my printouts (which seem to migrate on their own accord to places unknown). I'm also eagerly awaiting your findings on Hichens -- and for that matter, more on the crew.

All the best -- Susan
 
D

David Huffaker

Member
Just a thought - Would you be interested in liting the "missing 65"? Some of us may have information or access to information that we did not know is needed. I often find this to be the case in doing my family genealogical information.

David Huffaker
 
Phillip Gowan

Phillip Gowan

RIP
Hi Dave,
Well, why not? I went back through my list and it appears I'm doing better than I thought--although I may have missed a few in my quick run-through, I'm only coming up with about 40 missing passengers at this point. There are a few beyond this that I don't have an exact date on but I do have at least the month and year or the year. If anybody wants to share anything about these, I'd be more than glad to hear it. Some of them I've worked on and found only dead ends. Others I've made some good headway on and think prospects of finding them are very good. Still others I have yet to "attack." Probably some will never be found, especially the Orientals.


FIRST CLASS
(YOU'LL NOTICE A LOT OF THESE ARE SERVANTS)

1. Ellen Barber (haven't tried)
2. Albina Bazzani (haven't tried)
3. Antoinette Flegenheimer (so far only dead ends)
4. Amalie Geiger (haven't tried)
5. Amelia Icard (so far only dead ends)
6. Gustave LeSueur (recently began to search)
7. Pierre Marechal (some clues-haven't panned out)
8. Adolphe Saalfeld (have an approximate date)
9. Augusta Serraplas (haven't tried)
10.Gertrude M. Thorne (some clues-nothing sure)


SECOND CLASS

1. Karoliina Bystrom (haven't tried)
2. Clear Annie Cameron (working on some clues)
3. Asuncion Duran y More (should have her soon)
4. Anna Hamalainen (Hamlin) (dead ends so far)
5. Wiljo U. J. Hamalainen (Hamlin) (some clues)
6. George Harris (not a clue!)
7. Miriam S. Kantor (good leads)
8. Fanny Lydia Kelly (good leads)
9. William J. Mellors (so far only dead ends)
10. Anna Sinkkonen (haven't tried)
11. Ellen Walcroft (have good clues)
12. Charles Wilhelms (haven't tried)
13. Elizabeth Wilkinson (haven't tried)
14. Rosa Pinsky (some clues--so far dead ends)


THIRD CLASS

1. Rosa Abbott (some good clues)
2. Mariana Assaf (haven't tried)
3. Banoura Ayoub (some very good clues)
4. Lee Bing (haven't tried)
5. Chang Chip (haven't tried)
6. Ling Hee (haven't tried)
7. Eliina Honkanen (haven't tried)
8. Abraham Hyman (good clues on him)
9. Annie Jermyn (see further details at end)
10. Carl Jonsson (good clues on him)
11. Ali Lam (haven't tried)
12. Fang Lang (haven't tried)
13. Margaret Madigan (almost there on her)
14. Mantoura Boulos Moussa (haven't tried)
15. Nora Murphy (some clues--all dead ends)
16. Juho Stranden (haven't tried)
17. Johan Sundman (haven't tried)

Annie Jermyn may be in the "Not-findable" category. After surviving Titanic she went to live with a sister in Lynn, Massachusetts for awhile and then moved to Peabody, Massachusetts and went to work for the local Woolen Mills. That is all that can be proven. But--there are three very different stories that were told to her nieces.

Annie's brother Thomas and her brother Harry told their children that Annie died on Titanic. That was obviously a purposeful lie.

Annie's sister, Mary Grace, told her children that late in 1912, Annie just didn't come home from work at the Woolen Mills in Peabody one night and no one ever heard from her again, nor was a body ever found although foul play was suspected.

Annie's sister's Susan and Elizabeth told their children that Annie had run off with an unsavory man that the parents disapproved of and never contacted her parents again. After Annie's mother died in 1934, her sister Elizabeth supposedly went to extraordinary lengths to find Annie--and supposedly was successful. According to Susan Jermyn's daughter, now Mrs. Audrey Sampson, Elizabeth located Annie through the family of the unsavory man she ran away with and she was still living with the man somewhere in New Jersey. Elizabeth Jermyn died in 1937 leaving two daughters who were deceased by the time I located other family members. Neither of these daughters left children, so if they knew more of what became of Annie, that information is lost forever.

Phillip
 
M

Mike Herbold

Member
Phil:
I was surprised to see Clear Annie Cameron on your list. I glanced again at her biography here on ET and pulled Ted & Dinah Dowding's 1997 "Clear to America by Titanic and Beyond" down off the bookshelf. Then I was reminded that although everybody knew about the early part of Clear Cameron's life, nobody knows what happened to her after 1913.

Did the trail dry up in Pennsylvania? There seem to be so many clues about her that it's amazing that there is no further record of her.

She sure was an attractive woman. I'm going to re-read her letters again now and think what might have been.....
 
Phillip Gowan

Phillip Gowan

RIP
Mike P.
No the dragoman is one I missed when putting the list hurriedly together--also missed Hanna Mamee (should I do a recount?)--so I'm up to 43 that are missing and there may be a few more. If I do a thorough recount I'm sure the number would be closer to 50. The dragoman probably should be lumped in with the Orientals as one of the least likely to be found.

Mike H.
Clear Cameron would be quite a prize and I've put considerable effort into finding her. So far nothing has panned out. Based on what I've tried and what I know about her, my guess is that she married late, had no children, lived a quiet life in which she seldom mentioned Titanic and died prior to the early 1960's in relative obscurity. I found Mrs. Cassebeer in a very unusual way and, knowing how that worked, I'm currently trying the same tactic on Clear, Nellie Walcroft, and crew member Joseph Charles Chapman. If it works again on even one of them, I'll expand the effort to some other missing ones. I'm still not sure but what I found Mrs. Cassebeer as a fluke (thank God for flukes!). If the tactic worked only that once, it was sure worth it.

Phil
 
S

Senan Molony

Member
I came across a woman only yesterday in a Spanish newspaper from 1962 claiming to be the oldest living Spanish survivor. Her name was Fermin Odilva, or something of that sort. She was then 93. I don't find her name on the passenger list.
So is she an impostor - or a married-up bona fide passenger?

I can give you the references later Phil, if you want. Will need to go back to the National Library, but luckily enough I work beside it.

Thought Marechal was killed in a plane crash.
 
C

Chris Dohany

Member
Senan,
Sounds like the woman you speak of is Fermina Oliva, Mrs. Penasco's maid.
 
G

Geoff Whitfield

Member
Hi Senan, The lady to whom you refer was the Penasco maid. I have found a "colony" of Marechals living in the 1920's and 30's on the South Coast around Brighton. Almost all of them appear to have been called Pierre! I'm working my way through them!
Geoff
 
Phillip Gowan

Phillip Gowan

RIP
Hi Geoff, I've checked the death records from 1925 thru 1950 and found only one Pierre Marechal who died in England during that period--and that was 1949. But that individual doens't seem to match the Titanic survivor. I'd be very interested in anything you come up with on him.

Senan,would love to get a copy of what you found on Dona Fermina Oliva y Ocana.
 
B

Barbara DeCrow Goldberg

Guest
This is in response to Kritina's message concerning Jack Phillips. I have done some research on him and am very interested in obtaining any additional information. Please contact me privately at [email protected] and perhaps we can exchange information.

Barbara
 
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