Electricity During Sinking

[Poobah_2020]

It also points to the engine room being dry until the break up because if the engine was getting flooded at around 01:40 Titanic time, the time at which Phillips sent the "Engine Room getting flooded" or "Engine Room full up to the boilers" message, the circuit breakers in the engine room would have all opened and any electrical supplies from them would have ended. This would include the main lighting.

Then why sent it out as the last distress? I tend to believe in a critical situation as that, they would say what they mean and mean what they say - the Engine Room was full up. If this wasn't the case, why not say, "Boiler Rooms flooding" (Again, that they didn't say this is why I hypothesize that the boiler rooms, were mostly dry, save for the forward most).

The only possibility to why they would lie would be to make the situation seem more critical than it was at that hour, and I don't believe they'd resort to that.

 

[Ioannis Georgiou]

The boiler rooms were also called engine rooms.
Philips was not familiar how everything on a ship was called.
Also we know from surivors of the black gang that boiler rooms Nos. 3, 2 & 1 as well as the other parts were dry by 1:40 a.m.

 

[Rennette Marston]

The boiler rooms were also called engine rooms.
Philips was not familiar how everything on a ship was called.
Also we know from surivors of the black gang that boiler rooms Nos. 3, 2 & 1 as well as the other parts were dry by 1:40 a.m.

Thanks for the clarification. Obviously, if the ACTUAL engine rooms were flooded, the power would've gone out earlier. I believe the power finally went out when the Titanic broke between the third and fourth funnels after the initial break between the second and third funnels. I could be wrong.

 

[Rennette Marston]

Eventually, the bow plunged lower than the stern Edith Rosenbaum said she saw the starboard light at the water line as the stern went vertical. (Again, let's not forget the steam pipes holding onto the last vesture of power by a thread.)

Something like this...the very last moment before the pipes twisted apart and power shorted out for good:

View attachment 49324


Pardon, the sparks in my other diagram were meant to be discharging out of the 2nd funnel. I drew it over the 3rd by mistake.

I assume the pipes had to been made of lead, thus lead, a soft metal can certainly warm to extreme shapes before collapsing. Do we know if Titanic used leaden steam pipes or galvanized steel?

I doubt the pipes were that long enough to supply power. Seems illogical too me. By the time the bow seperated from the stern, all of its power would be gone in a split second - the stern last to lose power. At least that's how I understand it.

 

[Rob Lawes]

As I said though, don't get hung up on just the steam supply.

We also must consider the electric supply.

The steam supply to the turbine generators at your local power station may be in perfect working order but if the pylon comes down your house won't have a supply regardless of the output at the power station.

Water and electricity does not mix well.

 

[Rob Lawes]

Also we know from surivors of the black gang that boiler rooms Nos. 3, 2 & 1 as well as the other parts were dry by 1:40 a.m.

I have a theory and it's only that but I think it's possible.

I think, when the engine spaces were evacuated I would expect this would not have been done without at least passing the word to the Captain that this was happening or more likely, asking for permission to allow it to happen.

Bride and Phillips were passing messages to the Captain all night and on several occasions the Captain came into the Marconi room. From Bride's letter to the Marconi office, quoted in the US Inquiry, Bride says the Captain came in to the office to tell the operators the ship maybe had half an hour left.

My theory is that he told the operators at this point thst the boiler rooms or engine spaces had been evacuated and thst he didn't know how long the power would last. Or some words like that.

I think this is where Phillips derived his "full up to the boilers message"

If he was told that the power could go out at any time and thst the boiler and engine rooms had been evacuated he may have naturally assumed they were flooding. Being unfamiliar with the layout and mechanics of the boiler and engine rooms he wouldn't necessarily know where these compartments were but to the ships listening to his calls it would certainly convey a sense of increasing urgency and forewarn other ships that the power was likely to fail.

 

[Rennette Marston]

I have a theory and it's only that but I think it's possible.

I think, when the engine spaces were evacuated I would expect this would not have been done without at least passing the word to the Captain that this was happening or more likely, asking for permission to allow it to happen.

Bride and Phillips were passing messages to the Captain all night and on several occasions the Captain came into the Marconi room. From Bride's letter to the Marconi office, quoted in the US Inquiry, Bride says the Captain came in to the office to tell the operators the ship maybe had half an hour left.

My theory is that he told the operators at this point thst the boiler rooms or engine spaces had been evacuated and thst he didn't know how long the power would last. Or some words like that.

I think this is where Phillips derived his "full up to the boilers message"

If he was told that the power could go out at any time and thst the boiler and engine rooms had been evacuated he may have naturally assumed they were flooding. Being unfamiliar with the layout and mechanics of the boiler and engine rooms he wouldn't necessarily know where these compartments were but to the ships listening to his calls it would certainly convey a sense of increasing urgency and forewarn other ships that the power was likely to fail.

Seems like a plausible scenario.

 

[Matthew Chapman]

I believe it looked more like these pictures:

The Titanic is ten degrees down by the head and is listing heavily to port. This is when the her decks starts to buckle and her superstructure begins breaking.
View attachment 49314

In this scene, the bow twists, breaks from the stern, lists to starboard, and the portside resurfaces. When the ship broke, the lights on the stern changes from a light yellowish color to a "devilish red" color. The bow section is covered by a blackish haze and sparks from the second funnel which obscures her visibility to the survivors nearby. The bow's expansion joint open causing the two forward funnels to detach and fall down.
View attachment 49315

Here, the pointy-looking object to your left is actually the tip of the first funnel bobbing up after she detached from the bow.
View attachment 49316

The stern breaks again, this time abaft the third funnel in the area where the aft grand staircase once was. The lights finally go out.
View attachment 49317

After floating in the water for 3-5 minutes, the stern rotates, assumes an angle of sixty degrees, and sinks.
View attachment 49318

I will say, that is a nice visual Rennette, and seems to support different witnessings, of those who thought they saw the bow seemingly fully submerged, or bobbing otherwise. Lighting and smoke fallout looks good too. Nice work.

 

[Matthew Chapman]

Eventually, the bow plunged lower than the stern Edith Rosenbaum said she saw the starboard light at the water line as the stern went vertical. (Again, let's not forget the steam pipes holding onto the last vesture of power by a thread.)

Something like this...the very last moment before the pipes twisted apart and power shorted out for good:

View attachment 49324


Pardon, the sparks in my other diagram were meant to be discharging out of the 2nd funnel. I drew it over the 3rd by mistake.

I assume the pipes had to been made of lead, thus lead, a soft metal can certainly warm to extreme shapes before collapsing. Do we know if Titanic used leaden steam pipes or galvanized steel?

No offence, but that looks more like the off-spring of the Titanic and the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

 

[Rennette Marston]

I will say, that is a nice visual Rennette, and seems to support different witnessings, of those who thought they saw the bow seemingly fully submerged, or bobbing otherwise. Lighting and smoke fallout looks good too. Nice work.

Thank you! You're welcome to use them, if you like.

 

[Rennette Marston]

No offence, but that looks more like the off-spring of the Titanic and the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Or more like this:

Even this graphic is less crazy than Poobah's.

 

[Rennette Marston]

To continue on that point, as we know the break-up was slow process, we can ascertain these pipes were the last agent of strength holding the pieces of the ship together, suspended in the water. No survivor on the bow has claimed the forward end was cast in darkness, and why should they? On the contrary, we have several testimonies of what the survivors clearly saw at the bow. This could only mean the lights were still operable in the forward section.

But we have no evidence that the bow's lights remained on after the breakup, either. The bow herself had no independent electrical system to give her power since it was located in the stern of the ship, or at least that's what her plans show. Plus the pipes were not long enough to supply power and steam to all of the dislodged sections of the Titanic. At best, the lights on the bow would remain for a second or two before finally extinguishing.

Charlotte Collyer: "To me, she looked like an enormous glow-worm: For she was alight from the rising waterline, clear to her stern - electric lights blazing in every cabin, lights on all decks, lights at her mastheads."

Charlotte Collyer was describing what the Titanic looked like before she broke and sank. I doubt the Titanic was fully lit in the later stages of her sinking. More likely she would've looked like a dimly lit reddish mass against a star-speckled sky by, say, 2:15 AM.

 

[Ioannis Georgiou]

Charlotte Collyer was describing what the Titanic looked like before she broke and sank. I doubt the Titanic was fully lit in the later stages of her sinking. More likely she would've looked like a dimly lit reddish mass against a star-speckled sky by, say, 2:15 AM.

Yes and here is the longer version.

"I shall never forget the terrible beauty of the Titanic at that moment. She was tilted forward, head down, with her first funnel partly under water. To me, she looked like an enormous glow-worm; for she was alight from the rising water line, clear to her stern — electric lights blazing in every cabin, lights on all the decks and lights at her mast heads. ... The Titanic broke in two before my eyes. The fore part was already partly under the water. It wallowed over and disappeared instantly. The stern reared straight on end and stood poised on the ocean for many seconds."

 

[Rennette Marston]

Yes and here is the longer version.

"I shall never forget the terrible beauty of the Titanic at that moment. She was tilted forward, head down, with her first funnel partly under water. To me, she looked like an enormous glow-worm; for she was alight from the rising water line, clear to her stern — electric lights blazing in every cabin, lights on all the decks and lights at her mast heads. ... The Titanic broke in two before my eyes. The fore part was already partly under the water. It wallowed over and disappeared instantly. The stern reared straight on end and stood poised on the ocean for many seconds."

Thanks very much. I think Collyer was describing this scenario when she said that the bow was partily beneath the surface and "wallowed over" - that is that the bow probably twisted and broke from the stern and leaned towards her starboard side. But that is my interpretation.

 

[Rancor]

Her lights stayed on even after her break up, would it be interesting to know in wether any modern ships that capsized/ sank that her own lights lasted as long as Titanic?

Have to be a bit careful on that one! There is survivor testimony for both the lights staying on and the electrical system failing before the break.