False Passengers Deliberate Hoaxes

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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
I have recently purchased a book about all the controversal things about Titanic and her passengers/crew, (and believe me, i will be posting more threads. I think it will be interesting.) and i have come to discover a large list of some false/unsure passenger that the Carpathia picked up as Titanic survivors and brought to New York. Now some are obvious spelling errors, and some i have no idea who they could be. If any one has any idea about these passengers, please feel free to post. I am hoping to come to a resolution about these people.

The following names were on the list of survivors picked up by the Carpathia and taken to New York, but do no appear on the passenger list. Taking this note with that of surviving crew, we are left with ninety-eight survivors too many as compared with the official hearings.
Total number not included in passenger list: 139

Bemora Ajal
Alous Akelseph
Badmoura Aloum
Louisa Anton
Mrs. Genova Argenia and two children
V. Artonen
William Asplund
George Barawich
Harrren Barawich
Marian Barawich
Rinat Barlson
Miss Bassette
Mr. K.H. Behr----------------Karl Howell Behr
Maggie Billa
Masy Bockstrom
John Bonas
Ros Bridget
Miss. E Brown---------------Edith E Brown
Miss. O.M. Burns
Richard Bury
Boyen Casem
Mrs. H.A. Cassebeer
Misss Victorine Chandonson
William E. Charles
John Charters
Foo Cheung
John Choonson
Mr. D. Collett
Gosham Collier
Miss. Harriet Crosby
Charles Daly
Sarah Daniel
Delia Deanodelman
Theodore Domunder
Agnes Doyt
Ars. A.A.Dick
Leonek Eldegrek
Mr. Renardo Emearmaslon
Daniel Fastman
Max Frolicher
Mrs. Frolicher
Mrs. J. Fulwell
Maria Hamann
Mis.. Jeannie Hanson
Croft Hemvig
Mrs. A,O.Holverson
Mr. Masabumi Hosono
Mrs. Jacques
Jules Jap
Miss Mary Jermyn
Iany Jerserac
S. Joblom
Siline Josburg
Katherine Joseph
Nigel Joseph
Carl Jusefa
Manera Jusefa
Miriam Kenton
Florence Kesorny
Krikoraen Kinorn
Erockau Kockovaen
Anna Kolsbottel
Miss Emile Koucher
Jos Krigesne
Hee Lang
Eleoneh Lare
Mrs. Gustav Lesneur
Amo Ludgais
Miss Roberta Maioni
Bertha Malle
Mrs. R. Maloney
Margater Manga
Mr. Paula Manga
Julio Manv
Bertha Maran
Hauwakan Marlkarl
Margaret Marrigan
Miss. Katey Marshall
Adele Marson
Marion Massey
Karl Mathgo
Ernest McCoy
Miss. Leila McDearmont
Anna McGovan
(Harrigan) Merrigan
G.D.Messelmolk
Anna Messelmolk
Amina Missulmona
Mrs. Phillippe Mock
Celia Modelmot
Bunrs Moubark
Erikorian Muhun
Hannah Nern
Margater Nevatey
Halin Noubarek
Jiron Noubarek
Samula Nubulaket
Anna Nyhan
Nicola Oamb
Miss. Olivia
Sourly Ollmson
Virma Olman
Helena Ongalen
Alfred F. Ornout
C. Anderson Osplund
Oumson?
Hobesa Patro
Miss. A. Pericault
Eames Person
Benoit Picard
Miss. Rose Pinsky
Miss Appie Ranelt
Anna Reibon
Mrs. Naman J. Renago
John Schurbint
Assed Scunda
Famine Scunda
Miss. Emma Segisser
Miss. Augusta Serepeca
Frederick K. Seward
Axel Shine
Agnes Sibelrome
Rose Sibelrome
Miss Anna Simpson
Beatrice Sindo
Mrs. L.P. Smith
Anna Sofia
H.B. Steffanson
Julo Strinder
Fituasa Submaket
Nicola Sulici
Miss Nellie Waters
Miss Helen Wilson
Amy E. Wimhormstrom
Phillip Zenn
Fabin Zuni

These are exactly copied from the book, as they appear. There are also a few said to be Finns, i'll add later.
 
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Brian Ahern

Member
Hi Hildur - could you clarify which list you're talking about?

Some of these passengers - Helen Wilson, Victorine Chandanson (misspelled, I believe), Miss Bassette (also misspelled, I believe), Miss A. Pericault, Miss Olivia (actually Oliva) and others - were servants who, at least on the list handed round to passengers, were simply "and Maid" or "and Manservant".

Some are obvious spelling errors. "Amy Wimhormstrom" is obviously August Wennerstrom, "Margater Nevatey" probably Margaret Devaney, "Miriam Kenton" Marian Kenyon.

Others - Frederick K. Seward, H.B. Steffanson, Mrs. L.P. Smith - are names that are spelled correctly and that belong to people definitely on the ship.

Honestly, if you are familiar with Titanic's passengers and you look at most of the names on the list you supplied, it is fairly easy to link the misspellings with the real individuals intended. I'm afraid I don't have time to go through it just now, but I always think doing so is a fun game.

Regards,
 
Dave Gittins

Dave Gittins

Member
This was raised on another thread.

The names that appeared in the press in 1912 were the product of a long chain of people, each of whom had the chance to make mistakes.

It starts with the clerks on Carpathia, who took down names, often from people with foreign accents or strong regional British or Irish accents. The names were collected and compiled into lists. The lists went to Harold Cottam, who transmitted them by radio. People on ships or on shore received the names and wrote them down. The names were forwarded to New York and elsewhere by radio, telegraph of telephone, creating more chances of error. Somebody wrote them down in the newspaper offices and somebody set the type. No wonder a mess was created!

As Brian said, trying to identify the people on these lists is a fun game, but it's a rather pointless game today, when the survivors have been correctly identified.
 
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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
The book is called Titanic Conspirisy, and it was made in 1995. I just bought it yesterday, when i found the list in the back. It was carefully copied out, and any spelling mistakes are what they are.
 
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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
Here are a few i think are right:
Foo Cheang---------Chang Foo
Charles Daly-------Charles Dahl?
Masabumi Hosono----Musabumi Hosano
Mrs. A.A.Dick-----Vera Gillespie Dick
Eames Person------Ernst Persson
Benoit Picard-------Berk Pickard
Miss Rose Pinsky----Rosa Pinsky
Axel Shine-------Ellen Shine
Anna Sofia-------Anna Sofia Turja?
Fabin Zuni-------Fahim Lenni
Anna Nyhan-------Anna Nysten?
Virma Olman------Velin Ohman
Halin Noubarek----Halim Moubarek
Mrs. Phillippe Mock----Mr. Philip E. Mock
Anna Messelmolk-------Anna De Messemaeker?
Anna McGovan---------Annie McGowan
Amina Missulmona-------Fatima Masselmany?
Miss Katey Marshall-----Mrs. Kate Marshall
Bertha Maran-------Bertha Moran
Mrs.H.A.Cassebeer---Genevieve Forsdick Cassebeer
Boyen Casem----Nassef Belmenly Cassum?
Miss E. Brown----Edith Brown
Hee Lang----Fang Lang
Krikoraen Kinorn-------Neshan Krekorian?
Miss.Roberta Maioni---On the ship with same name
Miss Mary Jermyn-----Mary Glynn?
These are just the ones that i came up with. There are also a smaller list of supposed Finns who sailed on the ship, that i got from Kalman Tanito
 
Michael H. Standart

Michael H. Standart

Member
>>The book is called Titanic Conspirisy<<

If you're talking about one of Robin Gardiner's books, you might want to look for a more reliable source. Conspiracy theories make for interesting reading but on close examination, the claims rarely hold up.

There's really nothing remarkable about the mistakes that cropped up. Some passengers were traveling under assumed names and that didn't help, but neither did the long string of communication which gauranteed that errors would just pile on to the ones already made. I think you'll find that down to the last man and woman, the real imposters who claimed to have been aboard were never anywhere near the Titanic or the Carpathia. Luis Klien anyone?
 
Dave Gittins

Dave Gittins

Member
It sounds like The Titanic Conspiracy, otherwise published as The Riddle of the Titanic, by Gardiner and Van der Vat.
 
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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
Yes, Robin Gardiner's book. But alot of it makes sense, and interesting viewpoints.
Here are more i figured out:

Alous Akelseph-----Olous Abelseth
Badmoura Aloum-----Ayout Banoura
Rinat Barlson------Einar Karlson
Masy Bockstrom-----Maria Backstrom
Mrs. D. Collett----Stuart Collett
Mrs. J. Fulwell----Mrs. J. Futrelle
Miss Jeannie Hanson----Miss Jenni Hanson
Miss Mary Jermyn-----Miss Mary Glynn
Miss Emile Koucher----Amelia Kenchen(maid)
Mrs. Gustav Lesneur--Mr. Gustav Lesneur
(manservent)
Margaret Manga------Mary Mangan
Margaret Marrigan-----Margaret Marrion
C. Anderson Osplund----Carl Asplund
John Schurbint-------Jean Sheerlinck
Julo Strinder--------Juho Stranden

This are the Finns that i got from Kalman Tanito, who did a page on the Finnish passengers aboard Titanic, and these are delibrate hoaxes and possible additional passengers:

Salomon Korkeakoski According to Vaino Yli-Havunen of Kauhajarvi

J.Lindqvist, There is a contemporary newspaper account describing his experiences

Heikki Mikkila From Toysa, according to Kimmo Kiiseli

Ida Pihlajaniemi (nee Vdeanpaa, later Seppala, living in Florida in 1982, aged 95) daughters, Tyyne Maria(later Collins, from Florida) and Vieno Ester(from Arizona), who travelled 24 or 25 days from the wrecksite to New York, as stated in an article in the Tamperelainen(Tampere, Finland)

Jalmar Vienola Who was on Titanic's maiden voyage from Halifax to New York, according to a Finnish weekly from the 1950's

Obviously, i don't believe the account of Ida Pihlajaniemi and her daughters, Tyyne and Vieno. The Titanic would not have taken 24 to 25 days to cross the Atlantic, and it sank,(duh!), and there is no mention of the Carpathia, oir any other reliable information about this woman and her daughters.

Aso os Saloman Korkeakoski, this is not the first time his name has came up. Several times over the years, i have heard rumour he died on the ship, in second class, where he was listed as a business man, heading to New York. However, other than those rumours, there is nothing more to suggest he was on the ship.


I know that alot of the Titanic conspiracies are fake, but a few often makes me wonder. I mean, we have learned alot over the years, but maybe we are learning the wrong thing, about different scnerios, in order to protect a name, and/or a class.

I think i may have spelt a few words wrong, but forgive, i am Finnish, and i just learned english a year and a half ago.
 
Michael H. Standart

Michael H. Standart

Member
>>Yes, Robin Gardiner's book. But alot of it makes sense,<<

Interesting take as the book is considered something of a laughing stock among serious Titanic historians. Conspiracy theories of any kind are based on a mountain of distortions, half truths, and often blatant falsehoods along with heaping helpings of irrelevancies and this one is no different.

I'd be leery of taking anything it has to say all that seriously.
 
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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
yes, be a joke as it many, i take all things in to consideration, because i want a damn good reason as to why so many innocents died at the hands of a man who was so good at his job. I look at all things Titanic, however real or false they are, just because you never know unless you look. I have come to believe most the book is indeed a laughing joke based off such falsehoods and misinterpretations, but a few things just have to make me wonder about it all.
 
Michael H. Standart

Michael H. Standart

Member
>> because i want a damn good reason as to why so many innocents died at the hands of a man who was so good at his job.<<

There's no mystery to this at all. The reason so many innocents died is because the ship they were sailing on was sufficiently mismanaged so as to cause her to take a nose dive to the bottom of the North Atlantic before any help could arrive. This isn't rocket science and I don't need Robin Gardiner's help to figure this out.

If you really want to work things out, go to primary sources rather then the spinners of tale tales involving impossible ship switches.
 
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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
i don't believe it wqas a ship switch, i just think it was ridiculus as to the lenght of the Captain's history at sea, and the he sank this ship. I would think he would have had more knowledge not to be speeding and such things.
 
Michael H. Standart

Michael H. Standart

Member
>>i just think it was ridiculus as to the lenght of the Captain's history at sea, and the he sank this ship. I would think he would have had more knowledge not to be speeding and such things.<<

And you may be on to something with that. The one thing you have to keep in mind is that there was nothing at all unusual about how the Titanic was operated. Just about every ship on the North Atlantic run was operated in the same manner and under the same assumptions. Captain Smith was hardly unique. Just damned unlucky.
 
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Hildur Panula-Heinonen

Member
yes, he was unlucky was'nt he? What do you think about the lifeboats? I would imagine that the captain would have had the sensebility to make sure all his passengers could be saved in the event of a disaster, but did he not speak up as to how many lifeboats there were? I think who ever set the guidelines for the size of ship vs. amount of passengers = amount of lifeboats. Given the sheer magnitude of Ttitanic, i am suprised Captain Smith seemed to have no issue. If maybe, he did speak up about it, though i have heard he did put the collapsibles on, he could have saved many more lives. I wonder, was it his fault that he wanted to look magnificant, and because he was perfectly align with the law, that he only had twenty lifeboats, so the ship would look good?
Who would be at fault if not him? He was Captain of the ship, and could have stepped off, it just surprises me that the lack of knowledge of the amount of passengers, vs. amount of lifeboats, did'nt seem to bother him. Could the Board of Trade or the White Star Line be at fault? The lifeboats were based off much smaller ships from the late 1800's, and not of 1912.
 
Michael H. Standart

Michael H. Standart

Member
>>What do you think about the lifeboats? I would imagine that the captain would have had the sensebility to make sure all his passengers could be saved in the event of a disaster, but did he not speak up as to how many lifeboats there were?<<

I think you may be assuming that Captain Smith may have had more authority and influance then he really had. Looking magnificent really had nothing to do with it. The simple fact of the matter is that he may not have been asked for his opinion at all. As far as White Star was concerned, the officers and crew were employees plain and simple, even if some were the trans-Atlantic celebrities of the day. They knew their place and stayed in it if they wanted to continue working. The debate and the decisions were made at a much higher level and they stuck. Captain Smith may well have been bothered by it, but he knew better then to make waves in public.

In other words, when it came to the design and fittings of the ship, it just wasn't his call to make. Those decisions were made at the corperate level.

The one thing you have to keep in mind was that the pervasive attitude towards lifeboats of the day. What they had in mind was building enough damage resistance into a ship so that she could act as her own lifeboat until help arrived. When it did, the idea was to use the boats to ferry the passengers and crew to a rescue vessel. It worked well enough in some comparatively recent casualties such as the RMS Republic so there was no reason to believe that it would be necessery to evacuate everybody before help arrived.

In that sense, the Titanic served as a rather nasty wake up call.
 
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