Gates?


Dave Gittins

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Apr 11, 2001
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Scotland Road actually had pleasant associations for third class. Near its aft end, wide stairs gave easy access to the third class dining saloon. The passengers would have been familiar with it.
 
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Matt Pereira

Guest
ahh ok, didnt know that, i thought Scotland Road was just a crew passage only since it provided access from the stern up to the bow and stairs to the boiler and engine castings.
 

Shel Cooper

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Nov 8, 2013
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There were gates photographed in the bow, but this area was long emptied before it flooded. As for the gates at the stern, that whole area is compressed and shredded so it's not accessible.
 

l bush

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Jan 19, 2015
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It really shouldn't matter what the staff were trying to keep the 3rd class away from...Locking them behind gates on a ship in the middle of the ocean, how many floors under the deck is inhumane and a death sentence. The 3rd class paid for a ticket just like any other class. I take it they had no right to a moonlit stroll? They had a to go below deck at a certain time and be locked down like animals? They weren't kept away from the food they were kept away from the rich. And of course being further below deck made them closer to the rising water levels. They were doomed....
While I was at the TSOD, I took a tour with a guide I hadn't been with before. He described the "locked gates" as gates to where the food storage was located, and that the gates were locked to keep the third class passengers (and perhaps communicable disease) out of the foodstuffs. I invite any of the cast members who lurk here to comment on this as I had never heard of this before. But I do believe the locked gates had to do with cargo, and not with keeping third class passengers away from the lifeboats.

Kyrila
 

l bush

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Jan 19, 2015
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If the gates caused the poor to be trapped long enough for all of the boats to be filled before any of the 3rd class or lower could get into them, then they created just enough of a barrier for the people who bought the more expensive tickets to survive.
The lower decks would have felt the iceburg hit first which would have brought them up to the deck first, IF they could have gotten out. They were probably told by staff that there was nothing to worry about and only when their cabins began to fill with ice cold water did they know the truth.
Then, of course, it was too late. With 1,000 ppl in a mad panic to get to the deck to escape, I'm sure the gates became less of a factor. The men probably worked together to tear them apart.
 

l bush

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Jan 19, 2015
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Just as someone else mentioned...3rd class passengers would probably take one trip in a lifetime and the 1st and 2nd would probably be repeat customers of White Star.
I don't think that it is sensational at all to think that the Line would go to extra lengths to protect it's travelers that had more wealth. It would certainly hurt their own reputation if they had reached NYC and some of the wealthy had been robbed by the 3rd class or lower that were on board the ship.
White Star didn't feel that securing a gate for a few hours overnight was asking too much. It kept their rich safe and secure and the less wealthy in their place.
It was supposed to be an unsinkable ship. They didn't realize that they were putting so many lives at risk and if it came to it, go unlock the gates and let them out.
It was 1912...segregation was VERY obvious. We aren't talking about riding on a plane with first class and business.
We are talking about a ship that had people like Vanderbuilts and JP Morgan. You don't just let anyone have access to their territory. Do I believe there was lock down at night? Without a doubt in my mind.
 

l bush

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Jan 19, 2015
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I just read in the testimony of one of the 3rd class survivors....Olaus Abelseth, he testified in front of the US senate after the wreck...
There were in fact gates and the steerage passengers were climbing on top of the cranes in order to reach the higher decks. That was the
only way that they could get out.
 
Mar 22, 2003
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www.titanicology.com
The question of locked gates is introduced in Chapter 8 of the book: Report Into the Loss of the SS Titanic: A Centennial Reappraisal, History Press 2011. A comprehensive and objective treatment of the issue is given in Appendix J, "The Question of Locked Gates," by Cathy Akers-Jordan and Geoge Behe.
 

Charles

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Mar 28, 2015
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So were there GATES? No one really answered my question. I know that no one really knows the truth but I wish I knew if maybe there were.
I don't know either , but I am just going to guess there is one near the second class stairwell on E Deck , or on scotland road by the first and second class galley entrances midships.
 

Charles

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Mar 28, 2015
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No , I looked at the deck plans of the squash court staircase , and it turned out to use the steerage cabin hall on F Deck. There must have been a locked gate that the first class passengers would have locked on their way to play Squash on G Deck.

No wait , my mistake , I saw the deck plan on the encyclopedia website (here) and I noticed that a stairwell for steerage at the bow had a bostwick gate on E Deck , which seemed strange , it must have went to the sea man's quarters and mess hall.

And this stairwell had a bostwick gate.
 
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Charles

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Mar 28, 2015
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There is one more so wait... On E Deck, near the aft 3rd class gangway door on scotland road, there is a bostwick gate, which is also the same place the 3rd class passengers were guarded by. There is another bostwick gate at the stop of the stairway, which is what I mean, so the gate on E Deck would have probably been opened... Wait, there are 2 of them! My bad, the 2 E Deck stern gates would have been opened most likely telling that passengers gathered at gates at tops of stairwells. The Deck plans are here for you to look at.

Titanic Deckplans : D Deck

Titanic Deckplans : E Deck

The point is , Bethany , your questions are finally answered!
 
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Aug 31, 2015
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Little Gate referred by Buckley

Hi I wonder where was gate which was reffered by Daniel Buckley? He says it was little gate in in the upper part of Stairwell. I will be very glad if someone shown exact place on plan.
 
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Jack Dawson

Guest
Hi, I think that was the gate leading from the forward well deck (third class promenade) to 'B' deck, forward. There was one staircase leading up, near the portside cargo crane. At the top of the steps was a small gate, no higher than just about waist high. It's in the movie. You know where we see the ice falling into the starboard side of the forward well deck? The gate is briefly seen as Captain Smith and other officers are walking towards it (from B deck) and discussing how serious the damage is.

The gate itself doesn't seem to be any real obstacle, and it seems (from Daniel's account) that the bigger problem was the sailor blocking their way. He even mentions that a fellow passenger was going through the gate and was thrown back down into the well deck by a crewman; the guy is obviously not pleased about that, so he climbs back up only to find that the crewman locked the gate and ran off. He breaks the lock and through runs through the gate to find the crewman that threw him, but never found him. The lock must not have been too substantial; but even if it had been I would have just hopped over it.

You can find Daniel's full testimony in his own words here: TIP | United States Senate Inquiry | Day 13 | Testimony of Daniel Buckley (Third Class Passenger, SS Titanic)
 
Aug 31, 2015
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Thanks for answer.

I was also all time wonder where was cabin of Buckley. It seems that it was somewhere on g deck near bow. But I can't understand why it is not known.
 
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Jack Dawson

Guest
Hi Matthew Boyer Fan, no one really knows what cabin he was in because there are no surviving documents recording it. I think the Purser would have been in charge of that, but I could wrong. We do have the so-called 'Cave list' (recovered from the body of a steward) which lists cabins in his section of the ship, but even it seems to contradict survivor accounts when it comes to cabin numbers and who stayed where.

When it comes down to it, we can make a guess and that is about it. We know it was probably a G-deck cabin (starboard side), especially since it was flooding fairly rapidly so soon after the collision. Daniel was traveling with a group of other Third Class passengers; he would have been berthed forward with the men from his group most likely. Since he was probably staying with the three other men, his cabin probably had four beds. Cabins section D (G deck) (cabins in BOLD are starboard cabins) 226,227,232,233,237,238,239,241,242,244, and 246 are possible candidates for his room.
 

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