How Much Ice Fell on the Deck?

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Aaron_2016

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Does anyone know how much ice actually fell on the deck and if the weight of it caused the ship to list to starboard? From the Titanic Inquiry survivors said:


Mr. Lucas
Q - How much ice was there on the deck there?
A - I suppose, about a couple of tons.

Mr. Buley
Q - I believe, after the collision you found some ice on the deck?
A - Yes, on the well deck.
Q - Was there much?
A - A couple of tons.
Q - Of block ice?
A - Of block ice.

Major Peuchen
"It looked like shell ice, soft ice, but you could see it quite plainly along the bow of the boat."

Mr. Crowe
"I heard there was several hundred tons of ice found."

Edith Russell in a 1934 account
"We noticed a number of sailors walking on the lower deck. We heard a crunching sound. I remember remarking they were walking on a ground of ice."



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May 3, 2005
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This is an interesting development.

If you go by what you see in the movies (both ANTR and the 1997 "Titanic") only very little ice on the decks are seen.

In ANTR, just a stray piece of ice seems to be kicked around in sort of a game on the forward well deck.
 
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A

Aaron_2016

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A few years ago I read they had found a huge rock or boulder sitting on the deck, exactly where the ice had struck and fallen on the deck. Is it possible that the iceberg was not entirely ice, but concealed a number of rocks? Which is stronger ice or rock?


The boulder appears on the wreck.



boatdeck01.PNG


boatdeck2.PNG



Icebergs with boulders, big and small.

icebergboulder.PNG



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Dec 4, 2000
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A large percentage of the population in Titanic’s day was quite familiar with commercial quantities of ice. It was the only feasible means of refrigeration for most households and many businesses. So, I would expect that a 1912 sailor would be reasonably accurate in “eyeballing” the amount of ice that fell on deck.

Freshwater is normally taken as 62.4 pounds per cubic foot. Ice is lighter in weight because water expands as it freezes. The accepted weight of a cubic foot of ice is 57.2 pounds.

How much is “a couple of tons” of ice? Not all that much. Using British “long” tons, that would be about 4,500 pounds. Taken at 57.2 pounds per cubic foot, we get roughly 80 cubic feet, or a single block of ice about four and a half feet on a side.

Looking at it another way, a square foot of ice one inch thick is considered 5 pounds. “A couple of tons” would be roughly 900 square feet one inch thick. That would be a square patch of deck 30 feet on a side.

Put into perspective, a one inch thick steel plate typical of that in Titanic weighs roughly 40.8 pounds. That’s eight times the weight of an inch of ice. A cubic foot of steel would be nearly 500 pounds in weight, if you could find one laying about.

-- David G. Brown
 

Harland Duzen

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Jan 14, 2017
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While there's no rock visible, it doesn't mean it isn't possible the iceberg could contain bits of rock within it. I remember one 2012 Titanic Documentary (possibly one done by Nat Geo) they theorise that rocks within the berg could have damaged the hull.

However, the chances of small lumps of rock staying on the ship after a 2 mile dive is impossible and can't be proven unless we find a rock impaled into the hull.
 

Mark Baber

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If you go by what you see in the movies (both ANTR and the 1997 "Titanic") only very little ice on the decks are seen.
What's shown in movies is only what the movie maker wants to show. It doesn't prove that that's what actually happened.
 
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Aaron_2016

Guest
No it does not, there is nothing what you claim.
Calm down. The boulder is not my theory. It was on the news a few years ago. I am simply repeating what others said. Does nobody else remember it? I showed what I believed may have been the boulder.


Any clues what the dark patch is in the image you provided?



deckboulder.PNG


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Harland Duzen

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This photograph drawn in the Southampton ''The Sphere'' May 23rd 1912 shows the Forward well deck from Joseph Scarrott point of view after he saw the Iceberg passed by:
scarrott_titanic_sketch.jpg

Picture taken from Paul Lee's website (http://www.paullee.com/titanic/iceberg.html) Used for informative purposes only and property of Paul Lee.)

While the Photo could be dramatised since it was mainly meant to show the size of the iceberg (that Porthole should't be there and where's the Starboard crane?) It does show a large mound of ice covering the deck. Definitely more than the few boulders you see in the 1997 film.
 
Apr 26, 2017
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A few years ago I read they had found a huge rock or boulder sitting on the deck, exactly where the ice had struck and fallen on the deck. Is it possible that the iceberg was not entirely ice, but concealed a number of rocks? Which is stronger ice or rock?


The boulder appears on the wreck.



View attachment 3101

View attachment 3099


Icebergs with boulders, big and small.

View attachment 3100


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yes, it is true that many icebergs do carry rocks and boulders however I doubt a boulder fell onto the well deck. and its just as possible that the iceberg that doomed titanic had pebbles and stones. But don't believe any boulders. esspecially any that close to the top of the iceberg and near enough to the edge to fall off. i just dont think it to be true. its plausible but unlikely
 

Charles

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Mar 28, 2015
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According to Elanor Ileen Johnson Shuman, who had a forward cabin with her family, the collision knocked her brother out of bed, and ice landed outside their door. I am not sure how true this is, but some portholes may have broke on E Deck or other decks from the collision.
 

Andrew

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Oct 25, 2016
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I don't want to get too far off topic here, but exactly how did the Titanic manage to dislodge ice from the berg?
The ice would've needed to fly upwards & outward from the berg during the collision in order to land on the well-deck.
But the iceberg, taking the submerged 80% into account, would have been gigantic.
Could the 'glancing blow' really have vibrated the iceberg to that extent?
 

Andrew

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Oct 25, 2016
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Thanks for the reply Sam.
So to be clear, there was an overhang on the iceberg? And the vibration of the ship hitting the iceberg knocked off some chunks of this overhang?
Or did part of the ship itself actually hit the overhang?
 
Mar 22, 2003
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You don't need an overhang for chunks of ice falling from near the top of the berg to fall onto the ship. They could have bounced or rolled off part of the berg's side as they fell thus falling outward as well as downward toward the nearby ship which was right alongside.
 
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Scott Mills

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No it does not, there is nothing what you claim.
What you have marked in you picture is nothing more as a kind of unsharp object based that this is a photo mosaic done with thousands of snap shots done from different highs and angles.

Like in this one, no large boulder visible.
View attachment 3104
I agree Ioannis. Its very difficult to imagine how a bolder could remain on the deck given the degradation in the wood and supporting metal. It would have eventually fallen right through.

I agree, Sam. Fleet and Lee out of all of the people who survived and testified to having seen the iceberg were in the best position to gauge its size. As an aside, having never put much thought into it, it is interesting to think about where Fleet thought the berg struck and the actual damage we know was done to the ship.
 
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Andrew

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Oct 25, 2016
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But how would "loose chunks of ice" come to be sitting on top of the berg in the first place?
The exposed (above-water) part of an iceberg is frozen solid.
The impact force needed to break chunks off it would therefore have to be phenomenal.
Would the Titanic's glancing blow have been enough to do that? Surely the iceberg would barely have wobbled, let alone had bits crumbling off it?
 

Dave Gittins

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Apr 11, 2001
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Not so, Andrew!. By the time a berg reaches about 42°N it is more than a year old and it is quite fragile. A ship could easily knock pieces off it. Further north, iceberg water collectors actually knock pieces off with hunting rifles. I'm not surprised that some ice fell on the foredeck, just as witnesses described.
 
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