In the doghouse

Michael H. Standart

Michael H. Standart

Member
I just wish there was a White Star or a Harland & Wolff source extant somewhere to confirm that George. Unfortunately, I have a hunch it was one of those last minute improvised modifications that don't make it into the records.
 
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Daniel Klistorner

Member
All,

"Eaton and Haas place them on F Deck just across the passageway from the 3rd Class Galley..."

They got their plans from the Liability material. Many may know of the Liability case filed against the Oceanic Steamship Navigation, for the loss of property and life as a result of the Titanic disaster.

In 1914, Harland and Wolff submitted a general arrangements deck plan (for all decks) of Titanic. It is similar to the more popularly known Olympic 1911 plan, only this one was specifically for Titanic. This plan shows the Kennels on F deck. However, they may very well have been relocated during the actual voyage.

I have also seen an Olympic deck plan which places the kennels on the boat deck, and my personal belief, is that this is where they were on Titanic.

Regards,

Daniel.

PS. Eaton and Haas redrew the deck plan themselves and have copyrighted it. Anyone wishing to use it, can get it from NARA, and there are no copyright restriction on it at all, just credit NARA for it.
 
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Bob Godfrey

Member
Daniel, I agree. We know that at least some of the dogs onboard were exercised on the poop deck, and it would have been a daunting task for the 'minder' and a considerable inconvenience to others to coax the animals up and down several flights of steps and along a considerable distance of alleyways to achieve this on a regular basis.

It's possible, I suppose, that the dogs seen up top were all 'cabin passengers' and those in the kennels never saw the light of day, but otherwise the location on F deck is totally impractical. There have been suggestions that a location close to the galley would be convenient at feeding times, but it would have been a great deal easier to take the food to the dogs than the dogs to the upper decks.
 
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Daniel Klistorner

Member
Bob,

Also, regarding dogs being seen up top, I have never heard of any of the dogs actually being 'submitted' to the kennels. The Astors kept their dog in their cabin, so did the Carters, Mrs. Bishop, Miss Hays and Robert Daniel and Henry Harper ... these are the ones I'm positive about.
I think Robert Daniel is the one that is believed to have gone to the kennels and freed the dogs. Which dogs? His was in his cabin on A deck, and as far as I listed, most other dogs were as well. Mrs. Rothschild hid her dog in her hand-muff, and if the dog was that small, I'm sure it was also kept in the Rothschild cabin on C deck. Mr. Harper had his dog in his cabin, and had it on his arm when he took it up to the boats with him. Harry Anderson also had a dog, but I don't know if he kept it in his cabin on E deck or this might have been the only dog in the kennels. From memory, Anderson's dog was not large, and thus was possibly kept in the cabin (E12). Perhaps the dogs were minded by someone every day and taken for 'poops', but so far as I can see, possibly none of them were actually kept in the kennels!

As for Miss Isham’s dog, no one really knows whether she had one or not.
Daniel.

PS. Here's the scan of the H&W plan which shows the kennels on F deck:

Screenshot 2017 08 31 224404
 
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Bob Godfrey

Member
Daniel, I wonder if the kennels were intended mainly (or only) for unaccompanied animals. Two dogs, for instance, are shown on the Contract ticket list with their own tickets for the cross-channel journey (along with a canary, which had no ticket but travelled for five shillings!)

Could there have been other candidates for the kennels? Does anyone know the White Star rulings about onboard pets? I assume the immigration authorities did not allow the (official) import of animals by steerage passengers, but what about 2nd Class?
 
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David F. Smith

Member
Oh come on now. The dogs must have been kept near the stern. ____________________near the
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Poop deck of course. LOL.. sorry, couldn't resist that!
 
Mike Poirier

Mike Poirier

Member
I was reading Helen Bishop's account and I caught something that I had not noticed before.

I think she probably gave the most definitive evidence as to where the dog kennels where. She says, 'The steward wouldn't let me take her to the butcher. He said she was too pretty, and she was the only one allowed to stay in the cabin.'

She was very specific in saying the butcher which means to me that she was either
A. Informed in advance that the kennel would be by the butcher
or
B. The steward told her where the dog would be kept.

Mike
 
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Bob Godfrey

Member
Ships' butchers certainly were responsible for feeding the dogs (and other carnivorous livestock) carried. One butcher who served on the Queen Mary in the '30s told how he visited the kennels on the sun deck twice daily with rations of cooked meat and brown bread - and that whilst his customers were usually dogs he had at times been required to feed exotics like big cats and even snakes!

The Shipping regulations of the time were quite vague about the carriage of animals other than farm livestock on passenger liners. They did specify that no more than 6 dogs could be carried as cargo, and that 'proper arrangements' should be made for their housing, maintenance and cleanliness. It was the responsibility of emigration officers at the port of clearance to ensure that such arrangements were in place, but it isn't clear just what kind of arrangements would have been considered proper, other than a general requirement that the health and safety of passengers (specifically in steerage) should not be compromised.

I'm of the opinion that such considerations would probably have required that any animals which were taken literally to the butcher would have been confined in a designated compartment (if on a lower deck) until the ship docked. The task of driving a small herd of nervous animals past the 3rd Class food preparation areas and up and down numerous stairways to get to the open decks for regular exercise would surely have been as much a health risk for the passengers as a problem for the animals and their handlers.

I imagine that the dogs in the kennels (wherever they were located) would have been those travelling unaccompanied as 'cargo', plus any that were housed there at the request of a passenger. Helen Bishop's pet was not of course the only dog 'allowed' to stay out of the butcher's hands, but any steward with an eye to a good tip would not want to dispel that impression!
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