Molly Brown


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Christine Geyer

Guest
In John P. Eaton,Charles A. Haas "Titanic - Triumph and Tragedy" there's a copy of the list of the demand of Requirement on payment of damages (my God, hopefully that's a good translation) of Molly Brown, which went to White Star Line after the disaster. Unfortunately I don't know the exakt page now. The accompanying text says that it was written and signed by her in Wiesbaden/Germany, which is where I live.

Does someone know what Molly Browns connection to Wiesbaden was ?? What was the reason that it was written here (there
happy.gif
) ?? I am very curious to know more about that.

Looking forward to hear from you -
many regards Christine
 
Mar 20, 2000
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Christine,

I'm not certain but I believe Molly's sister was married to a German prince or baron and so she may have been visiting Weisbaden. I'll check the Molly Brown book I have and see. I'll get back to you on it.

Randy
 
C

Christine Geyer

Guest
Thanks a lot Randy !! I am really curious about that and unfortunately I don't have any specific book about Molly Brown (yet). If you can find about about the names and maybe even locations where they lived that would be great. I was so surprised to see that this listing was done in my hometown.

I'm really looking forward to hear from you !!

Christine
 
Mar 20, 2000
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Christine,

I have had a peep through a book called "Molly Brown: Unraveling the Myth" by Kristen Iversen for information regarding the German connection in which you are interested.

First off, let me say that you may be able still to purchase this book as it was published fairly recently. For information you can write to:

Johnson Books
c/o Johnson Publishing Co.
1880 South 57th Court
Boulder, Colorado 80301 USA

Or you may try to email the company at [email protected].

OK. Although I've not been able to find a specific reference to Weisbaden, it would appear that Molly Brown visited Germany fairly frequently as her younger sister Helen (nee Tobin), the Baroness Von Reitzenstein, lived in Berlin. Also at one point - in the years just after the Titanic sinking in fact - Molly's teenage neice Florence Tobin studied dancing with none other than Isadora Duncan in Darmstadt, Germany.

In the spring or summer of 1913, according to Iversen's book (p 182), Molly went to Germany to spend time with her neice before bringing her back to Newport for her "coming out" season. They finally sailed from Europe to New York on the Hamburg America Line steamer "Imperator" in July of that year.

A bit about Molly's sister Helen: she spent most of her life in Berlin, had four husbands, including the Prussian nobleman whose title she retained (the Baron was in the Kaiser's elite guard). She was much prettier than Molly and much more discreet. Helen's last husband was Sam Benet. The book doesn't say when she left Germany or when she died.

I hope this helps. I urge you to buy the book. You will enjoy it. The definitive account of Molly Brown's life, the book is impeccably researched and thoroughly entertaining. If you like Molly Brown now, you'll love the old gal for sure after reading this book.

All my best,

Randy
 
C

Christine Geyer

Guest
Thanks again, Randy !! That's very interesting and I think this book should be among the top of my (loong) Titanic-book-wishlist. Maybe I can find out something more about her stays in Germany. I think I have seen her whith sister/cousin on a photograph at the cemetary in Halifax.

About her list of demand to the White Star Line I would've thought that this is one of the things she'd done from home and sooner after the tragedy. Don't you think ??
 

Kyrila Scully

Member
Apr 15, 2001
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In Kristen Iverson's book about Margaret Brown, she alludes to Margaret's father being involved in the Harper's Ferry uprising, about how proud the family was of his role, and how Margaret's daughter remarked in the 60's that it was about time the "colored people" stood up for their rights at last. Nothing more is said about John Tobin's role at Harper's Ferry. Since all of the revolters - both black and white attacking the armories together - were killed or hanged save one black man, it can be assumed that John Tobin did not throw in with John Brown in the revolt. But can anyone define what exactly his role in the event was? Thanks.

Kyrila
 
Mar 20, 2000
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Kyrila,

Perhaps he was a supporter of the cause but was not in the revolt itself. Maybe it was family lore. I think a web address is given in the book for Kristen Iverson or at least an email for the publishers. They may be able to direct you to either Iverson or Muffet Brown.

Randy
 

Kyrila Scully

Member
Apr 15, 2001
2,079
35
243
South Florida
Thanks, Randy. After rereading it, I found a sentence about how John Tobin may have worked at a "station" along the "Underground Railroad," which was precarious as he was working for the government at the time. I also found the name of the woman at The Breakers who supplied Dr. Iversen with information about Molly's participation in rescuing fellow guests during the fire. I plan to give her a call later. The woman I spoke to at The Breakers didn't know anything, but did request one of my brochures. They may have me come to do a show during a High Tea or something.

Kyrila
 
M

Muffet Laurie Brown

Guest
You'd have to check with Kristen Iversen's notes for a possible response on why Margaret was in Wiesbaden at the time of signing the claim against the White Star Line, but it was probably just in the course of travels. Ivesen would only know who MTB was visting IF there were contemporaneous, relevant letters she might have seen in Benziger family collection, which I only briefly browsed, and her notes are in storage, waiting for a library to be made ready at Molly Brown House Museum in Denver someday. She wouldn't know off top of her head. The bottom line is MTB went back overseas several times in the year or so after the sinking, and fairly soon, to see various people and travel to various places. She filed the original claim in New York, (perhaps hastily before travelling?) and then she must have directed her lawyers to amend the values and items on her claim, from wherever she was at the time. She had to certify her signature for the amended claim and did this at the nearest U.S. consulate, I'd guess. The claim in E & H is the amended one. Her brother-in law, Baron Von Reitzenstein, had been Austrian, I think, so no automatic connection there. But I also seem to recall MTB's sister Helen was living in Portland, Oregon, married to another of her 4 husbands at the time of Titanic. Don't quote me there.
 

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