Passengers' dogs

[Mike]

I know it seems trivial, but at least in one case (the Great Dane) it allegedly cost a woman her life. How many dogs were there, to whom did they belong, & what breeds were they? So far I have:

Harry Anderson's Chow
The Astors' Airedale "Kitty"
Helen Bishop's "Frou-Frou"
The Carters' two dogs, one an elderly Airedale
Robert Daniel's French Bulldog "Gamin de Pycombe"
Henry Harper's Pekingese "Sun Yat Sen" saved
Margaret Hays' Pomeranian - saved
Anne Isham's dog (perhaps the Great Dane?)
Elizabeth Rothchild's dog - saved

Any other details?

 

[George Behe]

Hi, Mike!

Your list is accurate except for Miss Isham. I've never seen any evidence to support the contention that she had a dog on board the Titanic.

All my best,

George

 

[Daniel Rosenshine]

Hi!

It is actually possible that Anne Isham did have a dog, which she must have kept in her cabin, or less likely in the kennels.

Another Dog you missed was Mrs Rothschild's dog, which she kept in her cabin, on the star board side, on C deck, just aft of the forward staircase.

Daniel.

 

[Chris Dohany]

I believe William C. Dulles also had a dog on board. No idea what the breed was, however. I'm curious what evidence there is suggesting Isham had a dog? Like George, I've not seen anything substantial to support it.
Chris

 

[Jeffrey M. Kern]

An old 1912 newspaper article speaks of a woman who died on the ship (according to other passengers) who had a St Bernard, which is somewhat similar in size to a Great Dane, albeit different in features. It is more likely that this was Ann Isham, as I have heard from some other sources that she did die as a result of not wanting to leave a dog. What other choice was there? Did Miss Isham merely, therefore, stay because she felt it unnecessary? Or was she as speculation has it, like Mr George Wright, who slept in his cabin until the very end (as it may be so)? More than likely this is the woman so many stories have popped up about, who died as her dog did not have a chance to survive in a lifeboat (although I think they should have since there was plenty of room in all of the lifeboats). I look forward to hearing more a detailed, factual story soon on Miss Isham! (It was Ann.)

 

[George Behe]

Jeffrey wrote:

>An old 1912 newspaper article speaks of a woman >who died on the ship
>(according to other passengers) who had a St >Bernard, which is somewhat
>similar in size to a Great Dane, albeit different >in features. It is
>more likely that this was Ann Isham, as I have >heard from some other
>sources that she did die as a result of not >wanting to leave a dog.

Hi, Jeffrey!

Could you name some of those sources for us, old chap? I've never seen the slightest hint that Miss Isham was travelling with a dog; rumors and third-hand stories to that effect are one thing, but reliable documentation stemming from *primary* sources is another thing entirely.

Thanks, Jeffrey.

All my best,

George

 

[Jeffrey M. Kern]

This old newspaper article was entitled 'Her Life For A Dog', and it came out on 6 May 1912 by the London Daily Sketch. I had, only a year and an half ago, wondered about Miss Isham and how she died, and Mr Phillip Gowan had speculated also that this was who he thought it might be, as I assume that he, too, had heard of the story of the woman who was seen floating with her arms wrapped around a large dog (Great Dane? St Bernard?). They are speculation, as you know, but it seems only reasonable, as there is really no account of a Third Class passenger bringing with them an animal, is there? (There is the account of Second Class passenger Mrs Nye having walked off the Carpathia with a little yellow canary, but that is wholly smaller than a dog). I hope this sheds a bit of light as to my sources.

 

[George Behe]

Jeffrey wrote:

>This old newspaper article was entitled 'Her Life >For A Dog', and it
>came out on 6 May 1912 by the London Daily >Sketch.

Hi, Jeffrey!

Did this article specifically say that Miss Isham owned a dog, or did it just describe the sighting of the woman clinging to the St. Bernard?

>I had, only a year
>and an half ago, wondered about Miss Isham and >how she died, and Mr
>Phillip Gowan had speculated also that this was >who he thought it might
>be, as I assume that he, too, had heard of the >story of the woman who
>was seen floating with her arms wrapped around a >large dog (Great Dane?
>St Bernard?).

The sighting of the woman and the dog is a well-known incident -- it's the identification of that woman as Miss Isham that I question. The way I see it, there's no reason that Mrs. Allison or Mary Mack or Delia Henery couldn't have clutched at a swimming dog during her final agony and died in the water together with the animal. Since there seems to be no real evidence that Miss Isham even *owned* a dog, IMO linking her name with such an animal seems to be a pretty shaky proposition.

>They are speculation, as you know, but it seems >only
>reasonable, as there is really no account of a >Third Class passenger
>bringing with them an animal, is there?

There's nothing wrong with speculation. However, since we have no reason to think that our list of dog owners is complete, any number of previously-unsuspected passengers might have brought dogs with them on board the ship, too (including Miss Isham.) Without some sort of documentation, though, trying to link the body of unknown person A with the body of unknown dog B seems like an exercise in futility (although I've been guilty of doing that myself occasionally, too.)

All my best,

George

 

[George Behe]

Hi, Jeffrey!

I've had a chance to look at the 'Sketch' article. I'll quote it here for everyone's benefit:

The Daily Sketch, Monday, May 6, 1912:

"Another young woman went down with the Titanic
rather than desert her dog- a huge St. Bernard and a great favourite on
board. When the lifeboats were being launched a seat was prepared for
her, but she demanded that the dog be taken also.
"This was impossible, human lives being the first consideration, and she
was urged to sacrifice the dog and save herself. She refused, and was
last seen on the deck of the vessel, clasping her pet to her bosom. Her
dead body was afterwards found floating by the side of her dog.">>

Although there might very well be some truth to this story, I rather doubt that it was referring to Miss Isham. The owner of the above-mentioned St. Bernard is described as 'young,' but -- unless I'm mistaken -- Miss Isham was around fifty years old.

For what it's worth.

All my best,

George

 

[Jeffrey M. Kern]

Thank you for the information. I wonder when someone will dig up the truth on Miss Isham? Let us hope it is soon! Thank you for giving it what it is worth, my good chap.

 

[Judy marvelli]

has any body ever heard about a newfoundland dog that was scooped out of the water into a lifeboat? I heard this some time ago but do not remember where I read it and have never seen anything about it since.Is it just another story?

 

[George Behe]

Hi, Judy!

It's a far-fetched story that the newspapers attributed to 'Jonas Briggs,' a Carpathia crewman. According to the story the Newfoundland was named Rigel and belonged to First Officer Murdoch. The dog swam around in the water 'looking for his master,' and later his barks prevented Carpathia from accidentally running down a lifeboat.

There's no truth to the story, though, nor did First Officer Murdoch own a dog.


All my best,

George

 

[Jan C. Nielsen]

Hi there!
In 1912, Robert Daniel's dog "Gamon De Pycombe" was purportedly worth $750 (because Daniel survived the sinking and submitted a claim for $750, representing the value of the dog). The champion French bulldog was seen swimming around after the sinking by R. Norris Williams. But the dog didn't survive. Does anyone know what "Gamon De Pycombe" stands for? Does anyone have any idea what such a dog would be worth today, if it was worth $750 in 1912? Just curious.

 

[Charles Provost]

I read somewhere recently that Mrs Charlotte Cardeza brought four little Pekinese dogs with her on the Titanic. Is this true? All the best,

Charles

 

[Charles Provost]

Joe: Concerning your message on Robert Williams Daniel's Gamon De Pycombe', if you want to know how the dog would have worth today, multiply the $750 sum by 11. So it will be $8250 exactly, but I don't know if such a dog is as much expansive as this today. I only heard that if you want to convert 1912 money to 2000 money, you have to multiply by 11. Hope this helps,

Charles

PS: Gamon De Pycombe is the name of a prominent French preson, but I don't know who he was nor what he did in the history.

 

[Charles Provost]

Joe: Concerning your message on Robert Williams Daniel's Gamon De Pycombe', if you want to know how the dog would have worth today, multiply the $750 sum by 11. So it will be $8250 exactly, but I don't know if such a dog is as much expansive as this today. I only heard that if you want to convert 1912 money to 2000 money, you have to multiply by 11. Hope this helps,

Charles

PS: Gamon De Pycombe is the name of a prominent French person, but I don't know who he was nor what he did in the history.

 

[Jan C. Nielsen]

Thanks Charles, I'll keep looking for something about who "Game De Pycombe" is.

 

[Rachel Boland]

I remember reading in a book recently about an eyewitness account from another ship that went past the wreck area the next morning and the passengers saw bodies in the water. One said that there was a dead woman in a night dress clutching onto a 'fluffy little dog'. I am not sure of the exact words at the moment.

Could a passenger still on the ship have found a little dog and held onto it, hoping to save it?

I wish I still had the book so I could look at the exact wording. I loaned it to a friend (who is in the current tour of Titanic the Musical) and I am not sure when I will get it back!

 

[mikeh]

Rachel:

It seems to me I've seen it in a few places. In "Titanic Halifax" by Alan Jeffers and Rob Gordon, here's what it says:

Johanna Stunke, a first-class passenger aboard the North German Lloyd liner "Bremen", which had just passed by Titanic's grave on the way to New York, described the scene: "We saw the body of one woman in only her nightdress and clasping a baby to her breast. Close by was the body of another woman with her arms tightly clasped round a shaggy dog. We saw the bodies of three men in a group, all clinging to a chair. Floating by just beyond them were the bodies of a dozen men, all wearing life belts and clinging desperately together as though in their last struggle for life."

Mike

 

[Laurie Day]

I know that there were dogs aboard The Titanic. Did it carry any other livestock?