Re Empress of Ireland

[Dennis Smith]

Hi All,
I have just discovered this thread, and I`m ashamed to say I know nothing of the "E of I". I may be opening "old wounds" (so to speak) but could anyone give me any info, no matter how trivial, on dates, causes, weather etc. Please help as I know NOTHING except that there were about 800 passengers lost.
I`m an ex sea-faring Brit and as I said I"m ashamed not to know anything about such a disaster. Help!!!

Best Regards
Dennis

 

[Mark Baber]

Hello, Dennis---

There are other sources---especially a book written a few years ago called (I think) "Forgotten Empress"---which go into more detail, but http://www.greatships.net/empressireland.html gives a brief description of the collision that sank E of I.

 

[Dennis Smith]

Mark,
Cheers for the info, I`ll go have a look see.

Bst Rgds

Dennis

 

[Gavin Murphy]

........or even my own here on ET at

https://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/articles/empress_murphy.shtml

G

 

[Mark Baber]

Hmmmm...Gavin's article does seem to have a few more details than we have on Great Ships, doesn't it?

 

[Dennis Smith]

Mark,
Yes I agree with your "Hmmmm". Gavin`s article does give far more info than the original site offered by yourself, but there is enough info on your site to get people interested in the "E of I", so good luck to you. I learned what actually happened to the "E of I", which is far more than I knew before visiting, now I want to delve deeper so Gavin`s article does help more.

Thanks for the start - really appreciated-

Best regards

Dennis

 

[Dennis Smith]

Gavin,
Thanks for the info, it was really interesting considering more passengers were lost than on the "Titanic".

Your page was very thought provoking, why is it that the biggest passenger loss has been basically ignored by all historians. I have been in the British Merchant Marine for about 16 years and have never heard about this disaster and ironically sailed with "Canadian Pacific".

Maybe as you say , the "T" had all the "Glory" because of the maiden voyage. the issue of Bruce Ismay, the cock ups etc.

At the end of the day however it is nice to delve in a subject I know nothing about, so thanks for the info-


Best Regards


Dennis

 

[Geoff Whitfield]

Dennis, As Mark says, check out "Forgotten Empress" by David Zeni, published in the U.K; Canada and even in German. It's an excellent book and the guy who put together the passenger manifest is an absolute wizzard!

Geoff

 

[Eric Sauder]

Hey, Geoff:

Don't know about the Empress manifest, but this same guy has saved my butt on several occasions with Lusitania passengers and crew!

Eric

 

[Mark Chirnside]

I must recommend as well a book by Derek Grout [sic?], entitled Empress of Ireland, story of an Edwardian liner. It's out by Tempus and was published late last year, priced £19.99.

I knew little about the liner until I got a complimentary copy of this book, and I found it very well researched. I understand that the author is a friend of David Zeni, and that his book also drew on Zeni's research. A wholehearted recommendation.

Best regards,

Mark.

 

[Dennis Smith]

To All,
Thanks very much to you all for your input.
I`ll see about getting hold of the books suggested as soon as poss.

Thanks again everyone.

Best Wishes and Regards

Dennis

 

[Gavin Murphy]

Here is an update re: EofI and selling of artifacts,

P Beaudry now plans to take his case to the UN to fight for the right to sell 500 artifacts from the Empress. He will go to UNESCO next month to argue that Canada is not justified in blocking him from selling the objects, valued at $1.5 million (US), to a Florida museum.

The gov't has said the artifacts from the wreck must remain in Canada. He wants UNESCO to declare that Canada's export restrictions are not enforceable.

Two points:

1. I am not sure that UNESCO is the place to go. Perhaps a legal challenge that the specific application of the export rules against him are a breach of his constitutional right for equality under the law........others have successfully sold off Canadian heirlooms to foreigners.

2. If a museum or gov't stepped up, he could donate and receive a tax credit, which is an "indirect payment", albeit throught the back door, and at the taxpayer's expense.

Anyway, food for thought. And you all thought the selling off of Titanic artifacts was a bag of snakes. HA!

G

 

[Shelley Dziedzic]

Wow- this is quite a development. I am thinking his tax credit could not equal a direct sale though. Does the museum have to be in Canada? I bet all will be watching to see how this pans out. Any precedents elsewhere for the courts to study?

 

[Gavin Murphy]

Time has now run out and Beaudry is free to apply for an export licence and sell his artifacts for $1.5 million US to a foreign purchaser.

A sad day for Canada, etc.

G

 

[Jason D. Tiller]

Hi Gavin,

"A sad day for Canada, etc."

Definitely...without a doubt.

Best regards,

Jason