Reactions to Lightoller's book

[Sarah S]

Good evening everyone,

when Lightoller published his book in the 30s, quite many titanic survivors were still alive. Have any of them (crew or passenger) expressed an opinion or gave any sort of public commentary on his book? (besides Harold Bride who famously called him out)
Was the piblication of his books widely discussed and created some form of buzz among the public?

Thank you, I am just curious to know about its general perception among survivors

 

[ScottyBK]

How did Harold Bride "call out" Lightoller's book ?

 

[Thomas Krom]

How did Harold Bride "call out" Lightoller's book ?

Titanic's Officers - Articles - Lightoller Defends the Accuracy of His Titanic Accounts

A website devoted to collating information on Titanic's officers, as well as the officers involved in the disaster such as the Carpathia and Californian.

titanicofficers.com

 

[Mike Spooner]

I hear a lot of the Mesaba message of ice warning did or not reach the bridge. Quite frankly would of captain Smith taken any notice of it? It would appear he was relying on visual sighting first.

 

[ScottyBK]

Thanks for the link Thomas, I never heard or read about the 1930s arguing between Bride and Lights.

I agree that Smith wouldn't have slowed down even if he had the Mesaba message. The whole thing is a red herring.

 

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

The book "Titanic Calling Wireless Communications During the Great Disaster" has the text of the Mesaba message to the Titanic on page 124. "Ice report in Lat 42N to 41.25N Long 49W to Long 50.30W saw much heavy pack ice and great number large icebergs also field ice Weather good clear"

The reply received from Phillips was "Thanks"

The message contained the code "SG," was one of two Marconi codes for Mater's Service Message. To me, this indicates that Phillips got the message but failed to immediately take it to the bridge, which is what he should have done with a Master's Service Message. And how do I deduce that Phillips did not take the message to the bridge? A Master's Service Message requires that the captain acknowledge receipt of the message, and nowhere is there an acknowledgment of that message by Captain Smith.

Titanic Calling is a compilation of all of the Marconigrams involving the sinking of the Titanic. It is based on a collection compiled by the Marconi Company for the Board of Trade inquiry.

The book was published in 1912 by The Bodleian Library.

 

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

Good evening everyone,

when Lightoller published his book in the 30s, quite many titanic survivors were still alive. Have any of them (crew or passenger) expressed an opinion or gave any sort of public commentary on his book? (besides Harold Bride who famously called him out)
Was the piblication of his books widely discussed and created some form of buzz among the public?

Thank you, I am just curious to know about its general perception among survivors

For what it's worth, Lightoller's book was pulled from publication after the Marconi Company threatened to sue

 

[Sarah S]

For what it's worth, Lightoller's book was pulled from publication after the Marconi Company threatened to sue

most of the „drama“ surrounded his comments on the Marconi operators, thus getting him in trouble with the company. But did other survivors comment on it? Did his book sell well?

 

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

most of the „drama“ surrounded his comments on the Marconi operators, thus getting him in trouble with the company. But did other survivors comment on it? Did his book sell well?

Sarah,

I'll admit that the only part of Lightoller's book I've read is the 5 or 6 chapters relating to the Titanic. His editor did not fact-check the book prior to publication. When the Titanic was leaving Southampton, Lightoller writes that Saint Paul is torn from its moorings and almost collides with the stern of the Titanic. He also says that Captain Smith put the engine forward to help push Saint Paul away (not exact quotes from the book but just to convey what Lightoller wrote).

The two errors that stand out here are that it was New York, not Saint Paul which almost collided with Titanic, and Titanic was under the command of a harbor pilot. Even though Smith was the captain, he was not in charge of handling the ship at this time.

Then, when Lightoller is on Collapsible B, he claims to have had a conversation with (Jack) Phillips about the Mesaba message. As we all know, Phillips' body was never identified.

I have not seen any comments from other survivors about the book, but I think the book tells a lot about Lightoller's character--and not necessarily in a good way.

The book is available to read online from an Australian site (it's in the public domain in Australia.) (Titanic and Other Ships, Charles Herbert Lightoller. Chapter 31. Project Gutenberg of Australia ebook. Most recent update April 2005. Last accessed February 14, 2023.) Ironically, I think if he had stayed with the facts, he could probably have won a lawsuit against the Marconi Company. Marconi's own documentation shows that Phillips received the message, but he did not take it to the bridge.

 

[Arun Vajpey]

The message contained the code "SG,"

On p29 of the hardcover copy of Booth & Coughlan's Titanic: Signals of Disaster, there is a copy of the actual Mesaba ice warning. It is not very clear but seems to be prefixed just "Ice Report" and there is nothing entered next to the code. Are we missing something?

Then, when Lightoller is on Collapsible B, he claims to have had a conversation with (Jack) Phillips about the Mesaba message. As we all know, Phillips' body was never identified.

Despite certain statements by both Bride and Lightoller, there is doubt if Jack Phillips ever made it to Collapsible B.

 

[Arun Vajpey]

Titanic Calling is a compilation of all of the Marconigrams involving the sinking of the Titanic. It is based on a collection compiled by the Marconi Company for the Board of Trade inquiry.

The book was published in 1912 by The Bodleian Library.

Did you mean 2012? I thought that it was published to commemorate the Centenary of the sinking of the Titanic.

 

[Mike Spooner]

Lightoller made it quite clear in his book that Jack Phillips was on lifeboat B and was in conversion with him to. However we don't believe his story why should we believe what was said at the inquires to!

 

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

Mea Culpa. I did mean 2012.

 

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

On p29 of the hardcover copy of Booth & Coughlan's Titanic: Signals of Disaster, there is a copy of the actual Mesaba ice warning. It is not very clear but seems to be prefixed just "Ice Report" and there is nothing entered next to the code. Are we missing something?


Despite certain statements by both Bride and Lightoller, there is doubt if Jack Phillips ever made it to Collapsible B.

Here's a copy of the Mesaba's warning to Titanic (and) all eastbound ships. Circled in red is the Prefix, which I consider to be SG. We can confirm the "G" by looking in the square marked "Office Sent To" and it plainly has MGY which was Titanic's call. On the far right is the box "By Whom Sent" with the initials SHA (which confirms the S) Stanley Adams, Mesaba's wireless operator.

The Marconi Company had two sets of Prefixs for Master Service Message, MSG and SG. Jack Phillips replied "Thanks" but there is no reply from any of the officers. Therefore, Phillips was negligent in doing his job as a Master Service Message carried the priority of drop whatever you're doing and get this message to the bridge, now.

In going through this exploration of history, I have discovered that the Marconi Company did not have standardized forms. Did that contribute to the confusion leading to the sinking? Perhaps. I'd be interested to see what others have to say.

 

[Jason D. Tiller]

unfortunately, I'm drawing a blank right now on the name of Mesaba's wireless operator, but there are his initials.

Stanley H. Adams