Scotland Road

  • Thread starter Colin W. Montgomery
  • Start date
Dec 6, 2000
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Hi Sam,

Bad wording on my part. The sliding door ones could be closed where they were or from the deck above? - Right?
But the hinged door ones only at the deck level on which they were situated?
 
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Bruce Beveridge

Guest
Samuel,

I have never looked into it that closely to state if there were any more then the four hinged doors you mentioned. Of course there were the sets in the fore well deck, but those don't count here.

I was having a conversation about the doors (in passing) with one of my friends who researches this issue in depth and I believe he stated that there were a few of the lateral doors that could only be opened from the door level - however, I never asked him to expound. This does not make sense according the BOT regulations. There may have been some other circumstances I am not aware of however.

Bruce
 
Mar 22, 2003
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After looking at the BOT report last night, I noticed they said the WTD on the Orlop deck aft (that would be at bulkhead N) was also of the "horizontal pattern," like those on E-deck and F-deck. So it appears that the WTD door there on the forward side of bulkhead N was sliding, and that there is a hinged door behind it that swung open into the refrigerated cargo space aft. This type of arrangement appears also at bulkhead F on F-deck where there were two sliding WTDs on fore side of the bulkhead behind which were two swing doors that opened into Turkish bath spaces and to the staircase. You can see these on the original NARA plans submitted by the White Star Line for Limitation of Liability hearings. My guess is that these WTDs, and the one on the Orlop deck, would normally be kept open all the time unless an emergency situation developed, or they wanted to test them. Access to the spaces on either side of the bulkhead would be by opening and closing the non watertight hinged swing doors behind them.

The hinged swing doors on the sides of the ship on E-deck were also watertight. There was a pair (one on each side) of the forward end of Scotland Road, one leading to Scotland Road from the port side aft of the engine room just ahead of bulkhead L, a pair (one on each side) of the forward 2nd class entrance, and a pair (one on each side) at the store entrances just forward of bulkhead N. (The doors at the store entrances were not identified in the BOT report but show up on the plans.) Of course all these side doors would be kept closed and secured by lever handles when not in port.
 
Dec 6, 2000
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Hello Sam, Bruce,

So after the collision and with the two WTDs at and near the after end of the Firemen's Passage closed, other than opening the aftermost of those two doors [impossible with the influx of water] there would have been no way of closing the two WTDs on bulkhead D - "the ones on either side of the drop down door on the tank top that led into the reserve bunker in hold 3."
 
Mar 22, 2003
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If these two WTDs were left open the small area between the two drop down WTDs could become flooded if hold 3 were compromised. But the drop down doors would prevent flooding of BR #6 aft and the fireman's tunnel and hold 1 forward thus confining flooding to hold 3. So these hinged doors were not as critical as one may believe, but did give some added protection in case one the drop down doors malfunctioned. Normally, these manual WTDs would be kept closed at all times unless someone needed access through them.
 
Dec 6, 2000
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Hi Sam,

Thank you for confirming what I understood to be the situation; and for the added info on those doors normally being kept closed.

Regards,
Lester
 
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Bruce Beveridge

Guest
Hmm, I posted a reply last night. but I guess it didn't take. Yes, those doors would not only be closed since that hold was being used for cargo, but they would have been locked. The access ways into cargo holds were always secured. Those doors were primarily used to access the hold if it were being used as a reserve coal bunker. So that means Jack and Rose wouldn't have been able to sneak through one of those doors to get into the hold to ahem inside of that car
happy.gif


Bruce
 
Dec 2, 2000
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Well, it took this morning, Bruce. Looks like a few of the gremlins plaguing the board are still lurking. Can't say as the cargo holds being locked is much of a surprise. There's really no good reason for any passenger or even some of the crew to go in there, and these aren't exactly the safest places on a ship to be nosing around in.
 
Mar 22, 2003
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The concept of these two hinged WTDs leading into the reserve bunker space area being locked closed is very interesting. Since there was no reserve coal stored in this area on the maiden voyage, it has been suggested by others that the space would have been used by the BR gang to cool off in. And it has been suggested that it was the through the drop-down WTD at the aft end of the vestibule area leading into BR 6 that Barrett had jumped through when the collision happened, not through the door leading from BR 6 to BR 5 as Barrett had testified. If these hinged doors were indeed closed and locked, then Barrett's testimony was indeed correct. And that means he was in BR 6 when the collision happened.
 
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Bruce Beveridge

Guest
There is no way they would have left an open passageway for the black gang to get into that cargo area. This was a big issue back then, and it was a rule. The reason why they locked down the cargo holds like that was to prevent pilfering. Not just by crew but by passengers also.

In fact a lot of things were locked down. Not only were passengers (and other crewmen's)valuables at risk, but the old saying was that brass is drink, so if it is not nailed down, or locked up - it will be gone in a matter of time.

Bruce
 
Oct 31, 2008
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Difference between Scotland Road and Park Lane

I know that Scotland Road was the main corridor on the Starboard side of the ship on E deck. I have also heard that this corridor was also called Park Lane by the Officers. Is there any truth to this? I also have read that Park Lane was the corridor on the port side of the ship on E deck. I would like to know if there is any truth to the Officers calling Scotland Road Park Lane or was it on the port side or did the name even exist at all.
 

Bob Godfrey

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Nov 22, 2002
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In the Titanic Inquiry testimonies of crew members and of the naval architect Edward Wilding there are several references to the working alleyway as 'Scotland Road', but nobody mentions a 'Park Lane'. The only use of this name I know of is by 2nd Officer Lightoller in his memoirs, where he states "I had been right fore and aft several decks, along a passage known as Park Lane, leading through the bowels of the ship on one side". The long corridor on the starboard side of E deck doesn't extend all the way aft, so it seems more likely that Lightoller was referring to the longer working alleyway on the port side, otherwise known as 'Scotland Road'.

Titanic incidentally wasn't the only ship with a 'Scotland Road'. This was a general term for the wide working passageway on many ships, named after a notably broad street in a poor and multi-ethnic neighbourhood of Liverpool. The real 'Scottie Road' was crammed with pubs and other places of entertainment, and therefore very familiar to all seamen!