Smith's Medals

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Frank McElroy

Member
E

Ernie Luck

Member
Inger

Further clarification. When I said they could get miniatures from Jewellers, on reflection this would be the exception rather than the rule. Most would be available from Suppliers such as Army and Navy stores.

British miniatures are about half-size. I have not got any myself but they are about the size of an English metric penny.

Frank.

Thanks for the sympathy about the decorating. I let my wife have the colour she wanted, but blue in a bedroom ?

Regards Ernie
 
Inger Sheil

Inger Sheil

Member
Many thanks, Ernie, for all the information you've provided! That clears up the query I had - I'll pass the information along to the branch of the family that owns the miniatures. I'll see if I can scan the images of the medals and/or the miniatures.

Lowe's commission as a probationary sub-lieutenant dates to July 1912. He had earlier in his career served as an RNR rating, while still an OS and AB in the merchant service (before attaining his BoT certifications). I believe you're right about the ribbons - Lowe's set has them. His RD was awarded in the 20s...if I get a chance, I'll dig up the entry in the medal roll over the weekend.

Good to see you in this thread, Frank
Happy
 
E

Ernie Luck

Member
Inger

We made it to the National Archives at Kew yesterday. Spent the morning there - all I can take in one session. If I was expecting a 30 page transcript of the medal roll for the Transport medal I was disappointed - it was three-hundred pages of original manuscript.

A few things of particular interest. It was initially called by his Lordships the 'Sea Transport Medal'. There was a special distinction for Masters who would have their names engraved on their medal followed by the words 'In Command'. A subsequent amendment authorised the names of other recipients to be engraved as well.

The biggest shock / disappointment was that according to the medal roll, Capt. Smith's medal was not presented by the King - very few were. I suppose it's not really surprising; as I have said it was a campaign medal and it would have been unusual for the Sovereign to present anyway. I think the logistics of getting seafarers together would have been extremely difficult. There seemed to be four methods of issue, presentation by the King (if you were in the right place at the right time you got to be lucky); presentation by the Director of Transport (probably an Admiralty bod); issued by the Transport Officer, Liverpool or Southampton, or finally and latterly, a 'Party' (they must have had a knees-up somewhere). E.J. got his medal from the Director of Transport on 26 November 1903.

I will have look at the Medal Roll for the RNR Decoration after Christmas (a collective sigh of relief from the membership) A bit more to come on another thread though.

Regards Ernie
 
Inger Sheil

Inger Sheil

Member
Sounds like you had a good old time there, Ernie - nothing like getting stuck into the fiche/film/original documents!

I wouldn't be surprised if there was a note of it in one of the Liverpool papers when Smith received the Transport medal, and another when he received the RNR Decoration.
 
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Ernie Luck

Member
Thanks for your response, Inger

I wonder if we have a Liverpudlian on board, with easy access to local newspapers?
 
F

Frank McElroy

Member
>Ernie, Yes, send me some info and I'll see what I can do OK. Frankie Mac
 
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Ernie Luck

Member
Frank

At the moment we don't know on what date Capt.Smith was issued with his RNR Decoration - sometime after it was instituted in 1908. The Transport medal was issued to him by the Director of Transport on the 26 Nov 03, but I don't know where exactly.

However, I believe E.J. was living in Liverpool at that time so there might be mention of it in one of the local papers in the last week of November or early December 1903.

Regards Ernie
 
E

Ernie Luck

Member
Frank

Further to my previous post, it's good of you to offer, but it can be a fruitless task looking at old newspapers on microfilm, especially if you have to travel any distance. I don't want to put anyone to any trouble unless they live on the doorstep of the County Archives.

We are going to try and post some close-up photo's of these medals tomorrow but cannot guarantee any success

Ernie
 
Inger Sheil

Inger Sheil

Member
It can be rather a drain on time (and eyesight!) Ernie, but a date - particularly for the RD - would narrow it down a lot. I'll add it to the list for a look-up at Colindale next time I'm over there. I wonder if Gary Cooper has any input on this? I'm sure he'd be interested in where your research is going.

Looking forward to seeing the medals! I need to make a note of scanning the miniature set and getting permission to post it.
 
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Ernie Luck

Member
Transport Medal, (obverse) bust of King Edward V11 in the uniform of an Admiral of the Fleet
93088
 
E

Ernie Luck

Member
Transport Medal, (reverse) HMS Ophir, below a map of the world, c 1903
93091
 
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Ernie Luck

Member
Dear Inger

Hope the above images are acceptable and not too large. I hope to get to Kew again shortly to look at the medal roll for the RNR decoration from the date of it's institution in 1908. Whether or not we go before Christmas is in doubt. Things to do but on the other hand it's likely to be quiet at Kew in the run up to Christmas.

My wife, Pauline, has been hinting for some while that she would like to go to the Newspaper library in Colindale, but I have been putting it off because of the journey - perhaps, this will give me the necessary impetus.

Yes. I have been in touch with Gary Cooper.

Regards Ernie
 
Inger Sheil

Inger Sheil

Member
Great photos, Ernie. The RD in particular I find a very handsome medal.

The newspaper library is haunt of very happy memories - I used to live not far from there (on the other branch of the Northern Line, though). Would call up on a Thursday to give them two days notice of the titles I wanted to reserve beforehand, and then keep cycling in new orders of originals and microfilm until closing time. Some disappointments...and some absolute gold!

Can't remember if Kew was very quite this time of year. I remember making a few last-minute pre-Christmas dashes, but I was usually limited to Saturdays - I find the staff there are very efficient in their turnover, although the fich and film room could get a bit hectic at times. The document reading room was never really a problem, though.

Good to hear you've been in touch with Gary!
 
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