Strange Normandie QuestionAccomodations


John Zoppina

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Feb 5, 2005
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Hi folks,

Just another of my random questions. I was going over a set of basic deckplans that I have, and I realized that it doesn't give the decks' heights. This only really matters in a few locations (to me, anyway)

Can anyone tell me the heights of the Grand Salon, First Class Smoking Room, and First Class Restaurant? (I already know the Grand Salon and the Restaurant were each 3 decks, and the Smoking Room was 2. Aside from that... I'm kinda in the dark)

Thanks,
John
 

Jim Kalafus

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Dec 3, 2000
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Lounge; 110 feet X 85 feet with the sides of the room rising 22 feet and the elevated central section 30 feet.

Smoking Room: 55 feet X 85 feet with a height of 22 feet.

First Class Dining Room; 305 feet X 46 feet with a height of 25 feet at the center.

Any others? I'll be glad to help!
 

Joe Russo

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Apr 10, 2006
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Wow, I didn't realize how narrow the dining room was. Almost like a hallway. It must have gotten hot in that room with all of the lights. I read that this was one of the rooms that was air conditioned (I guess for obvious reasons). Jim have you ever read or heard any stories about the temperature of this room? Was the lighting florescent or incandescent?
 

Jim Kalafus

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No, I have not heard about the temperature! I figure that the room was crampled and hard to gracefully negotiate, but assume that the A.C. made it at least bearable from that angle. The only room aboard the ship for which I have ever heard a temperature anecdote was the Winter Garden~ it became a sweatbox on the 1938 Rio cruise, and the heat killed off the birds and the plants.
 
Jul 9, 2004
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Random question slightly related to the subject of the Dining Room temperature:

This might fit under the crowdedness of the room too. Let us theorize here. Suppose you are pushing your way to your table and getting soup splashed onto you, etc. and suddenly you trip over some overly fashionable open toed shoe. What happens if you fall against one of those Lalique light stanchions? What if this is a woman in a flimsy chiffon evening gown? Would she not be burned by the hot glass of the light stanchion?

It (the glass) would be hot with all those lightbulbs behind it - wouldn't it? So can you imagine if you had a table next to one? It was air conditioned, but I bet it was only cool at the ceiling.

Just a question.
 
Jan 28, 2003
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But this catalogue of improbabilities seems not to have happened, does it, Brandon?

This seems to be one of those Health & Safety driven questions, which has little relevance except to make rules, and promote an industry (the H & S industry). Upon which many employees depend for their mortgage repayments and general livelihood, so they are hardly likely to admit that a scenario is so bizarre as to be worth ignoring completely - these days at any rate.

I wouldn't want to turn the clock back to the careless years of the early 20th century, but equally I don't think we are doing ourselves many favours by being either so timid these days, or indeed, so demanding of responsibility and compensation.
 

Jim Kalafus

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>But this catalogue of improbabilities seems not to have happened, does it, Brandon?

Actually, it is not all that improbable, and raises a good question.

I will drag out "The Shipbuilder" and get the specs on the stanchions, because now, Brandon, you have me wondering about the heat which could potentially have radiated from those pointless glass...symbols....which ate up so much of the already limited floor space. Unless they were fluorescent, by the point in the evening at which Billie Burke and Josephine Baker were hurling food at one another and shrieking insane accusations, the glass would have been quite hot~ and had Ms. Dietrich been pushed up against it in a backless gown while trying to separate the two celebrities rolling around on the floor like Jerry Springer Show guests, she may very well have gotten a painful burn.

I'll find out.
 
Jul 9, 2004
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If the dining room stanchions could have been hot - then imagine what is was like to sit beneath those in the Salon? How sweaty must many a piano recital attendee have gotten? Then there's the Grill Room and its columns... Normandie could have been a second degree burn waiting to happen!

EDIT: The reason I thought it was possible was thermal conductivity. Have you ever touched a light fixture's globe after the lightbulb inside was on for a few hours? I imagine that the thick Lalique glass must have taken a long time to heat up, but once it was hot it probably could have taken hours for it to cool.
 

John Zoppina

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Feb 5, 2005
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Sorry to interrupt... I have just one more question. Can you tell me the dimensions of Normandie's funnels?

Sorry for interrupting, and thanks,
John
 

Lucy Burkhill

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Mar 31, 2006
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Regarding the heat emitted from the dining room stanctions brings to my mind the illuminated glass surrounds that many theatre pipe organs were fitted with in the 1930's in British movie theatres. Now I don't know whether there are any theatre pipe organ enthusiasts on ET (if there are, I'd love to hear from you!), who have actually seen these surrounds, there are a number preserved here in the UK, but they were very fashionable around the time of the Normandie's heyday. Like the ship's dining room stanctions, they were Art Deco in design, fitted around the pipe organ console, and were illuminated by many bulbs inside the glass. The lights slowly changed colour to give a rainbow effect, which looked very spectacular to the audience. However, the heat generated by all these bulbs was considerable, and organists playing these particular instruments frequently complained of the heat, which was made worse by the organist's bench being illuminated to match the surround. I have actually sat at one one these consoles when they have been illuminated, and can certainly sympathise with those poor 1930's organists!

Regards,

Lucy
 

Grant Carman

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Jun 19, 2006
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Since we're talking about the lights in the dining room, does anyone know what happened to them? All that Lalique has me drooling.
happy.gif
 
Jul 9, 2004
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Grant,

I believe the dining room was completely stripped of its Lalique glass and the glass paneling on the walls. Not a single panel was broken in the process I have heard. Some of the pressed glass wall panels have come up for auction in California on eBay and I believe, either the dining room stanchions or what was left of the Salon stanchions went into a hotel in Chicago, along with some of Normandie's salon furniture. Where they are now? I have no idea...
 

Joe Russo

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Jim I'm not sure about the Normandie, but this website shows that the QM used incandescent lighting which ran on 240v DC and were either 25 or 50 watt bulbs. Not sure how hot light bulbs burned in the 1930's as opposed to today, but multiplied by the number of light bulbs in just one of those Lalique fixtures, that would be one big hot Easy Bake Oven. Then multiply it by the number of fixtures in the room as well as the lights on the wall. Maybe the high ceiling helped keep the hottest air at the top of the room, but I'm sure it would get uncomfortable if the AC wasn't blasting constantly especially in full evening garb. I guess this could make the whole theatrical effect of the room complete as it came with the hot lights like being onstage for your scene. It doesn't strike me that the builders of the Normandie would have thought to put lower wattage or voltage for the lighting at the time since she was basically an electric ship and electric power was probably at a surplus with that huge electric power plant.

http://uncommonjourneys.com/pages/electric.htm
 

Jim Kalafus

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Dec 3, 2000
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>Sorry to interrupt... I have just one more question. Can you tell me the dimensions of Normandie's funnels?

Hey, John! No need to apologise!

However, you have me stumped...briefly of course
happy.gif
I did a cursory read through of the Normandie Shipbuilder issue, and 'though I found minutae enouhg to make one's head spin, I did NOT find the funnel dimensions.

"This just in!" to use 1940s movie newsroom dialogue. Les Streater, who did the excellent Berengaria book a while back, has completed a five volume work on the Normandie, of which Volume 1 is now available. I've not seen it yet, but am looking forward to reading it and will post my review as soon as I can.
 

Jim Kalafus

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Volume #1 of 5 is already available. It covers the construction of the Normandie. I am waiting to hear back from Mr. Streater regarding how to order the books and will post that information as soon as I know!
 
Jan 5, 2001
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Hi Danny, Jim;

Mr. Streater posted the following information regarding his Normandie volumes on the Linerslist on yahoo groups. Since that was a public forum, I am sure he will have no objection to my re-posting to ET:

quote:

At long last the first volume in my five-volume series on Normandie is finished, and will be
available direct from me at the end of July. This will cover the design, construction and trials,
through 130 pages and several hundred photographs, many never published before.

Volume two will be out at the end of October, and will cover the public rooms and the cabins.

For those who may not know of me, I have been writing articles and books on ships and
maritime matters for forty years, the most recent books being on Queen Mary, Berengaria,
Aquitania and L'Atlantique.

A web site will be up and available by the end of July, featuring all these books as well as
details of Normandie ephemera I am selling.

Sample pages of volume 1 are available in PDF form.

Anyone wishing to know more details, to request the sample PDF or even to place an advance
order (?) is asked to contact me OFF LIST at [email protected]

Thanks

Les Streater
Best wishes,

Mark.​
 

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