Titanic passengers that cancelled or missed the crossing


Dec 6, 2000
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A very informative paper.

John Eaton wrote: >>As can be best determined, there were aboard at this point 2,228 persons — 1,320 passengers and 908 "working" crew. The figure of 2,228 was reached after minute examination of records and lists prepared by Titanic's owners and the official governmental bodies who investigated her loss.<<
I disagree. A minute examination of Records and Lists yields 2,208 as the best determination.

I hope that Mr Eaton will detail how his figures are arrived at. The figures from his co-authored book: Titanic A Journey Through Time concludes:
1st Class 337, 2nd Class 271, 3rd Class 712 = 1,320 with 908 Crew = 2,228
As these are the same figures [be it in more detail] presented in Mr Eaton's paper let us look at them.

I conclude Crew 891, but accept that if you add the 8 bandsmen and all "9" of the H&W Guarantee Group that a total of 908 is arrived at.
2nd Class. I conclude 284, but after deleting the 8 bandsmen and the 6 members of the H&W Guarantee Group who travelling on 2nd Class tickets and by leaving Alfred Nourney [booked to travel as the Baron van Drachstedt] as a 2nd Class passenger that 284 could be amended to 271.
3rd Class. I conclude 709. It would be interesting to compare my 709 names [essentially the same as the 708 on this web-site, plus Olga Lundin] with Eaton's 712.

1st Class. I conclude 324, but if you remove the 3 members of the H&W Guarantee Group who travelled on 1st Class tickets together with Alfred Nourney then the figure becomes 320. So where does 337 come from?
The US Senate says 329. The accompanying Passenger List names 322, to which we can add the name of the Carter manservant, Alexander Cairns. Why then does the Summary say 329? My conclusion is that they have added the small List of Telegraphic names appended after the Main List without realizing that the names are already in the Main List.

Senate_1st_Class_Summary-124691.jpg

It would seem that Mr Eaton has compounded the error by adding 8 to 329 to arrive at 337, which means that his 1st Class figure is over inflated by 8+8 plus Messrs Andrews, Chisholm & Parr who he has removed to form part of the Crew figure of 908.

I wonder who Crew member Thomas Hare is? - I have not previously seen that name in any Crew List [including Mr Eaton's own Crew List].

Lester
 

gordon atkin

Member
Mar 18, 2006
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I agree a very interesting article.
However i am puzzled by the list of ticketed passengers who did not sail at the end of the article. From the biographical details of passengers, Dwan is showed as being lost with a photo of his grave. Also O'Brien, Scanlon, O'Connell and Ryan are shown as being lost but if they did not sail then their bio details require amendment.
Do you have any further info please?
 
Dec 6, 2000
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Hello Gordon,

After a more detailed reading I also realized that there was a problem with the Queenstown List.

For my own information I made the following note:
12 [not 18 as claimed by Eaton] names on the Queenstown Boarding List BT 27/776
Denis O'Brien, James Scanlan, Pat O'Connell, Frank Dwan, Pat Ryan were on-board.
Pat Thomas 358573 is probably listed in error for Patrick Fox 368573 — double listed.
Frank Dwan was also double listed - For Fox and Dwan one entry was correctly crossed out, but neither should not be included in a List of those who Did Not Sail.
O'Brien, Scanlan, O'Connell, Ryan have lines under their names.

I also note that the Cave List has Mrs Lewis listed for D-31. - She was travelling with Miss Eastman. [see Titanic People by Craig Stringer]
I still doubt the claim by the Carlson family. The Carlson listed on the PL is probably Frans Olof Carlsson. On BT 9/920/201 Carlson, Frank is noted as having boarded at Southampton.

Messrs Melody & White as well as the Wilkinson ladies are also listed on BT 27/780B as are 7 intending 3rd Class Passengers not mentioned by Eaton:
Duyvejonck, Emma [rejected at Southampton] - 345776
Johannessen, Elias [hospitalized with appendicitis] - 312988
Lowe, Alfred - 373930
Miles, Fred - 392095
Sutton, Charles & Henry - 392085
Van der Steen, Henri [rejected at Southampton] - 345782

Interestingly Dr Jenkins [like the Wilkinson ladies and Messrs Melody and White] is on the PL listed given out onboard Titanic. That list also names a Mr Schabert, who as the name of Philipp Mock is omitted should probably not be confused with Mrs Schabert. Quite a number of names are not on that List.

Lester
 

gordon atkin

Member
Mar 18, 2006
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Morning Lester

Many thanks for your input which does help to clarify the position for me!!!

Best wishes
Gordon