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When did the stern completely rise above the surface?

Discussion in 'Collision / Sinking Theories' started by sir john adams, Nov 4, 2018.

  1. I have a minor question, but when exactly did the stern rises above the surface completely as in, there was space under the keel and the waters surface, and when this happened what was the angle of the ship? was the bridge at the waters surface at the same time?
     
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  2. Thomas C.

    Thomas C. Member

    It is hard to exactly place this moment in time, but the most likely is that it happened around 02 15. This moment is usually known as the beginning of the final plunge.

    George Symons:

    11501. Now just tell us about that?
    - After I left the ship I gave the order to pull away. We were pulling very hard; we were pulling very steady; a moderate pull. After I gave that order we pulled away I should say about 200 yards, and I told them to lay on their oars, and just a little while after that, after I saw that the ship was doomed, I gave the order to pull a little further and so escape the suction.
    11502. Now, just one moment. Just tell us why you say "after I saw the ship was doomed" you pulled away 200 yards? What was it that you saw that made you think that?
    - Because her forecastle head was well under water then. Her lights had all disappeared then. You could see her starboard sidelight, which was still burning, was not so very far from the water, and her stern was well up in the air.
    11503. When you say all her lights went out, do you mean right away astern too?
    - No, just her foremost lights had disappeared, and her starboard sidelight left burning was the only light, barring the masthead light, on that side of the bridge that I could see.
    11504. Then you saw her with her stern out?
    - Yes.
    11505. Will you give us an idea what angle was her stern as far as you could see? How did it look to you; was it all up?
    - More like that with a cant. (Describing.) I do not know what position you would call it altogether.
    11506. Was it out of water?
    - Yes.
    11507. Did you see her keel?
    - No, you could not see her keel.
    11508. (The Commissioner.) Could you see the propellers?
    - You could just see the propellers.
    11509. (The Attorney-General.) You could see the propellers?
    - Yes.
    11510. Then when you saw her like that, what was the next thing that happened?
    - Being the master of the situation, I used my own discretion. I said nothing to anybody about the ship being doomed, in my opinion. I pulled a little further away to escape, if there was any suction. A little while after that we pulled a little way and lay on the oars again. The other boats were around us by that time, and some were pulling further away from us. I stood and watched it till I heard two sharp explosions in the ship. What they were I could not say. Then she suddenly took a top cant, her stern came well out of the water then. (final plunge 02 15)

    When Symons looked at the ship, he saw something like that. The Titanic on this pic is 8* by the head.

    Symons.png
     
    IvanZagric1990 likes this.
  3. Kyle Naber

    Kyle Naber Member

    If you're referencing when the stern was at its highest point, that would've been at 2:18 with the tail of the ship was about 200ft in the air.
     
  4. Aaron_2016

    Aaron_2016 Member

    Fireman Frank Dymond took command of lifeboat 15. He said: "The current drifted us under the propellers of the Titanic which were sticking up in the air. She drew 33 feet of water, and her keel at the stern was 12 feet above our heads."


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  5. Tim Aldrich

    Tim Aldrich Member

    That would have been a terrifying view.
     
    Samuel Halpern likes this.
  6. Aaron_2016

    Aaron_2016 Member

    I believe the strong list to port may have elevated the starboard side propeller and the shaft above the water on the starboard side as she continued to roll over to port, and possibly this may have been the section that appeared to loom over their heads in the lifeboat.

    Althought it is quite possible that the ship was breaking apart and her stern was buckling upwards because Frank Prentice said the ship righted herself when they were lowering lifeboat 15. Dymond was in lifeboat 15 as it was being lowered and said "something happened" and the lifeboat was thrown hard against the side of the ship which damaged the lifeboat and he described a sudden mad rush by the men to get into the lifeboat and get the boat lowered down as fast as possible which alarmed lifeboat 13 which was underneath them.

    Frederick Scott was in lifeboat 4 on the port side near the stern. He said:

    "We pulled away from the ship’s side and we had not been away long before the ship started breaking up, and her stern went up in the air, and you could see her three propellers nearly the same as you can see them on the model."

    Q - You got away?
    A - Yes; we had just got at the stern of her when she started breaking up.
    Q - You say she started breaking up?
    A - Yes; she broke off at the after-funnel, and when she broke off her stern end came up in the air and came down on a level keel and disappeared.
    Q - It went up in the air and came back on a level keel?
    A - Yes.
    Q - Then did she go up again before she disappeared?
    A - No.
    Q - Simply sank?
    A - She simply sank.

    This could mean lifeboat 15 may have been underneath her keel as she was breaking up and her stern was buckling upwards.


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    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018 at 1:07 PM
  7. So many contradictions. Just what you would expect from multiple eyewitnesses.
     
  8. Kyle Naber

    Kyle Naber Member

    I highly doubt that a lifeboat was under the keel at any moment of the sinking. Maybe it felt like that because they were so close.
     
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