Which Wreck Would You Visit Thought Experiment


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Wayne Keen

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This is essentially a Gedanken experiment - a thought experiment. Imagine for a moment that your nature was changed such that you were essentially something like Superman. Invulnerable, greatly enhanced strength and senses etc. You can go anywhere, see anything, without risk to yourself. (Lets restrict things to Earth for a minute - I know I would head for the moon, and then Venus at some point)

Now, what wreck would you choose to find (if neccessary) and drop in on first? To make it interesting, make it not the Titanic. (Which would probably really be my first stop)

I think I might start by looking for the Shinano, the Japanese carrier that was supposed to be a sister ship to the Yamoto - but was changed into being a very large carrier - it was sunk by the Archer-Fish late in WW2.

Wayne
 

Matthew Lips

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Having eliminated the obvious first choice - Titanic - I would have to side with Daniel and choose the Andrea Doria.

Must be the Italian in me coming to the surface again. If you'll excuse the pun!
 

Matthew Lips

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Mind you, on reflection, I might be tempted to pick Waratah instead. That could finally answer the twin mysteries of a)what exactly happened to the poor thing and b) precisely where she lies.

This time, I guess it's the fact that I live in South Africa which influences my decision. In fact I live in Durban, from where she sailed for the final time, and in my youth often holidayed on the Wild Coast, where she met whatever fate she did meet.

Titanic would still be the unequivocal first choice, if Wayne hadn't banned her from the list!
 
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Wayne Keen

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Out of curiosity, would anyone's decision be influenced by the ship being a grave, i.e. remains are on board.

In the case of Titanic, the remains are probably long gone, so one would not encounter the real life spectre of a body. However in other famous wrecks, like the Edmund Fitzgerald, remains are probably still present and there are stories to the effect of them being pretty well perserved (note I said stories, not evidence).

If, however one felt they would run into the bodies of Ida and Isador, would that change your thoughts on visiting the Titanic?

Wayne
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>Out of curiosity, would anyone's decision be influenced by the ship being a grave, i.e. remains are on board.<<

In and of itself, no.

If you want to get really nit picky about it, there are precious few ships lost be accident or as a result of battle action in wartime that aren't a grave for somebody, but that's rarely been a deterrant to exploration.

>>If, however one felt they would run into the bodies of Ida and Isador, would that change your thoughts on visiting the Titanic?<<

Well, since Isadore's body was recovered, there wouldn't be any reason for me to look for him on the Titanic. It's easier to go to the Woodlawn Cemetary in the Bronx where he's buried. Ida I wouldn't be concerned with if only because if her remains are inside the ship...unlikely BTW...then they would amount a few bone fragments buried under tons of sediment. Either way, I wouldn't worry about it.
 
Apr 27, 2005
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Probably search the interior of the Doria, but the Japanese submarine with the gold bullion aboard is a tempting shot. Perhaps the Yorktown. Unlike Ballard, I see nothing wrong with retrieving artifacts, and I have no problem with the dead aboard a ship, provided they remain undisturbed or insitu. There remain so many ships in deep water, and each should be viewed, explored, and documented.
Eventually, Carpathia would be on my list, if only to retrieve the plack inside her, honoring her efforts in the Titanic rescue.
 
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Wayne Keen

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Sorry Michael, I was not clear. I mentioned the Straus couple only because that was one of the cabins that we saw the other night. I intended the question more as a thought question, not a historical one. For some, the prospect of coming face to face with a corpse might change their perspective on going in there, even though the premise of the question still holds, i.e. you can not be harmed in any physical way...

Wayne
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>For some, the prospect of coming face to face with a corpse might change their perspective on going in there, <<

You're right. It would. I don't think it would be all that pleasant for even thr most experienced and hardened explorers but by the same token, it doesn't seem to deter some of them. People who dive on shipwrecks find human remains all the time. An example of that would be the wrecks of the Japanese warships and auxilary vessels in Truk Lagoon. It's one of those things that just goes with the territory. If somebody can't handle that, then perhaps that somebody should reconsider wreck diving.
wink.gif
 
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Wayne Keen

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"If somebody can't handle that, then perhaps that somebody should reconsider wreck diving."

I can not argue with that logic.

I think I would be more afraid of getting lost/trapped in the dark - which is part of the reason for the invulnerability angle.

Wayne
 
Jul 9, 2000
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>>I think I would be more afraid of getting lost/trapped in the dark-<<

So would I. Depending on how the wreck lies, it's all too easy to get disoriented. Between that and the bends, divers get killed that way all the time. It's no game for inexperienced amatures!
 
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Wayne Keen

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Neither is my roof, hence I am not on it to try and patch some things. Clumsy, stupid and afraid of heights is not a good recipe for roofer.

Even watching the bots the other night, it was easy to get disoriented, and that was before the rust was falling.

Wayne
 

Inger Sheil

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HMAS Sydney - just to sort out once and for all the wheres, whys and hows and salute the dead. Then, after a quick zap up to South Africa to find the Waratah, I'd head over to NSW and scout out the Nemesis. After that I'd double back on my tracks for some vacation time around the Kinugawa Maru in the Solomon Islands...one of the prettiest wrecks I've ever dived, festooned in coral and wreathed in marine life.
 
Jun 4, 2000
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Interesting. I'm with Inger: HMAS Sydney, then Waratah. So, in answer to:
quote:

Out of curiosity, would anyone's decision be influenced by the ship being a grave, i.e. remains are on board.
My answer differs from many above, because it's yes. The impact of HMAS Sydney's loss is still keenly felt owing to the mystery of her demise and the final resting place of the ship and the men who served aboard her. However, I have no interest in looking through the wreck, my interest is simply the location.​
 

Inger Sheil

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quote:

My answer differs from many above, because it's yes. The impact of HMAS Sydney's loss is still keenly felt owing to the mystery of her demise and the final resting place of the ship and the men who served aboard her.
Agreed, Fi - it's not so much exploring the interiors but identifying the wreck and determining if it can shed any light on what happened in her final engagement and sinking that's important in the Sydney's case. There's still controversy over whether the Carley float found with a body aboard near Christmas Island was ex-HMAS Sydney, and seeing the interviews recently with those who lost loved ones who were going to contribute DNA in the hopes they could relocate the grave and retrieve evidence from it aiding identification was terribly sad.

There are many efforts afoot to find the wreck - although she could be very deep - so perhaps one day we'll know.

The Waratah reminds me of the Yongala, where many relatives went to their own graves never knowing what had really happened when the vessels disappeared. I spoke recently with a lady looking to commemorate the loss of her father's ship, lost with all hands in 1934. Although some bodies and wreckage were washed ashore, they've never found the vessel itself (there are currently a number of projects underway seeking to locate the ship). Her description of the effect of his loss on her mother, family and herself through the years was haunting. It wasn't a sinking on the scale of the Titanic, but for the sixteen men lost, the memory and the nagging questions remained long after the headlines. They persist to this day - over 70 years later. I look forward to the day she can be told that her father's ship - his grave - has been found.​
 

Mindy Deckard

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First choice for me would actually be the Britannic, not the Titanic in the first place because, although Titanic initially was the ship that caught my interest, the Britannic actually had a more interesting history in my opinion.

Other ships I would like to see are the Empress of Ireland, the Lusitania, the Bismarck, and the Andrea Doria.

And I would see the Titanic if given the chance too.


Well, I guess that about covers all the famous liners, doesn't it?
 
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