Zumwalt Class Destroyers

Jim Hathaway

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Dec 18, 2004
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Just a question on my mind since the DD versus DDG designation debate.
With our mix of Ticonderoga Class CGs, and Burke Class DDGs, do the CGs have any capabilities not possessed by the DDGs, or is the only difference what hull they are built on?
Perhaps as far as capabilities, the CG designation has become meaningless.
 

Pat Winship

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May 8, 2001
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Just for the record, Parks, I saw the crack about bearded women and laughed.

Pat Winship, who knows the difference between feminist and femiNazi.
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From Defence News.com:

Is New U.S. Destroyer Unstable?
quote:

As the U.S. Navy is poised to award the first construction contracts on its new multibillion-dollar DDG 1000 Zumwalt-class destroyer, experts in and outside the Navy say the radical new hull design might be unstable.
Given just the right conditions, some say, it could even roll over.
At least eight current and former officers, naval engineers and architects and naval analysts interviewed for this article expressed concerns about the ship’s stability.
One former flag officer, asked about DDG 1000, responded by putting out his hand palm down, then flipping it over. “You mean this?” he asked.

Ken Brower, a civilian naval architect with decades of naval experience was even more blunt: “It will capsize in a following sea at the wrong speed if a wave at an appropriate wavelength hits it at an appropriate angle.”
The Navy and the lead contractors, Northrop Grumman and General Dynamics, disagree. Officials from both contractors deferred to the Navy when asked about the design.
Navy leaders say the ship is stable and that they continue to test and refine the design.
“We feel very confident in the hull form,” said Allison Stiller, the deputy assistant secretary of the Navy for ship programs. “We’ve done all the modeling and testing to convince us that this is a great hull form.”
For the rest of this somewhat lengthy story, go to http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=2666991&C=america

Comment: Does anybody have the real stability data for this ship? I'm reasonably confident that the bugs are being worked out, if only because one HMS Captain in history is one too many. Nobody wants an encore performance.
 
Mar 3, 1998
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If you'll notice, the detractors do not have any direct affiliation with the program, while those who are in charge of, and personally responsible for, the safe operation of the ship attest to its stability.

It's easy, too, to throw bombs when you speak only on the condition of anonymity. For all we know, those people work for the competition.

CAPT Syring -- who was named in the article -- is my customer and from what I have seen, is very much on top of things. If he's happy, then I'm happy.

Parks
 
W

Wayne Keen

Guest
"is my customer and from what I have seen, is very much on top of things."

To me, there is not much better in the world than working for a smart customer.

Wayne
 
Dec 2, 2000
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>>If you'll notice, the detractors do not have any direct affiliation with the program, while those who are in charge of, and personally responsible for, the safe operation of the ship attest to its stability. <<

Which fact should hardly come as a surprise, but then, that's one of the reasons I asked about the stability data for the ship. It's been possible to do some reasonably accurate calculations on stability using little more then pencil, paper, and slide rule for nearly 150 years. Computers backed up by model testing can do a lot better, and the detractors look mighty stupid claiming the ship will roll over when the cold equations say it won't.
 
Mar 3, 1998
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I'm not sure that the proprietary data that you are requesting for a new-construction/technology platform is readily available. I certainly don't have it because even though I work on that program, I don't have a need to know.

Which makes me wonder how the detractors can speak so knowingly. How did a civilian naval architect (Mr. Brower) gain access to proprietary information? The article doesn't say, which tells me all that I need to know.

I don't put much faith in news stories that are based on "anonymous" source opinion. I am especially wary of headlines that end in question marks...that indicates to me that the reporter doesn't have the proof he needs to support his insinuations. To me, this particular story smacks of someone looking to extract some kind of payback.

Parks
 
Dec 2, 2000
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>>To me, this particular story smacks of someone looking to extract some kind of payback. <<

Wouldn't be the first time that sort of thing has happened. What I'm wondering is who this "Former flag officer" the article goes on about is, and where his paycheque is coming from. (I'll bet it ain't Lockheed!)
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From the Minneapolis Saint Paul Business Journal:

BAE Systems awarded $108.9M Navy contract
quote:

BAE Systems is being awarded a $108.9 million dollar contract from the U.S. Navy.

Fridley-based BAE will supply an Advanced Gun System (AGS), in support of the DDG 1000, also called the Zumwalt-class destroyer.
Story at http://twincities.bizjournals.com/twincities/stories/2007/04/23/daily25.html

Information on the weapon can be viewed at http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_61-62_ags.htm
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From Defence News.com:

First DDG 1000 Could Shift To Bath
quote:

U.S. Navy and industry officials are discussing a plan to shift construction of the first DDG 1000 Zumwalt-class destroyer from Northrop Grumman’s Ingalls shipyard to the General Dynamics yard at Bath, Maine.
Details of the plan still are being worked out, but if approved, the move would be a boost for Bath Iron Works, which is running out of shipbuilding work.
Navy, Northrop Grumman and General Dynamics officials all declined to speak publicly about the issue, citing the sensitivity of ongoing talks.
Navy officials, however, insist that the proposed shift does not reflect dissatisfaction with Northrop Grumman, which has been stung by criticism of its work on LPD 17 amphibious ships and the Coast Guard’s Deepwater program.
More at http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=2906161&C=america
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From Defence News.com:

U.S. Navy To Ask for DDG 1000 Proposals
quote:

With no decision on which shipyard will build the first DDG 1000 Zumwalt-class destroyer, the U.S. Navy may ask Northrop Grumman and General Dynamics to submit proposals on how they would proceed if the first ship moves from Northrop to GD.
“We are hopefully going to release an RFP soon on the dual-lead-ship strategy,”￾ Dub Summerall, a senior Navy shipbuilding official, told Congress July 24.
The choice of using the request for proposal (RfP) format to gather more information is being strongly considered, but no final decision has been made, said a Navy official.
More at http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=2924649&C=america
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From The Navy Times:

Bath to build first Zumwalt-class destroyer
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PORTLAND, Maine – The Navy agreed to a schedule change that bumps up construction of the first DDG-1000 Zumwalt class destroyer at Bath Iron Works, reducing an anticipated workload gap, Sen. Susan Collins said Tuesday.

The stealthy DDG-1000 is the successor to the mainstay Arleigh Burke destroyers built at BIW and at Northrop Grumman’s Ingalls shipyard in Mississippi.
Full story at http://www.navytimes.com/news/2007/09/ap_destroyer_070925/
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From the prnewswire:

Converteam North America $183M Contract for DDG 1000 Lead Ships
quote:

PITTSBURGH, Sept. 25 /PRNewswire/ -- The DDG 1000 Program has awarded
Converteam North America contracts as the High Voltage Single System Vendor
for the first Zumwalt Class destroyers for the U.S. Navy. The deal includes
contracts from Northrop Grumman's Ship Systems sector in Pascagoula,
Mississippi and General Dynamics' Bath Iron Works shipyard in Bath, Maine.
"Valued at $183.15 million, these contracts verify Converteam's
position as the most experienced electric propulsion integrator for Navy
platforms in North America," says Converteam's DDG 1000 Program Director,
Paul Thompson.
For the rest of the press release, go HERE
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From BYM Maritime:

Navy approves Raytheon Zumwalt ship computing environment
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Raytheon Company (NYSE:RTN) recently achieved a significant Zumwalt-class destroyer program milestone with the successful preliminary design review of the "Release 5" Total Ship Computing Environment Infrastructure (TSCEI).

TSCEI is a key element of the ship's overall Total Ship Computing Environment, which comprises six releases of software and more than 5 million lines of code. Each incremental TSCEI release adds improved mission capability and robustness to Zumwalt's computing infrastructure, upon which all applications will execute and interoperate.
For the rest, go to http://www.bymnews.com/news/newsDetails.php?id=17370
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From SignOnSanDiego.com:

GD, Northrop win destroyer contracts for U.S. Navy
quote:

WASHINGTON — The U.S. Navy has awarded General Dynamics Corp and Northrop Grumman Corp contracts to continue work on the DDG-1000 Zumwalt class of destroyers, according to the Navy and the companies.
Bath Iron Works, a subsidiary of General Dynamics, on Monday said it won a $142 million contract modification for long lead material procurement and pre-production planning to support detail design and ship construction.
For the rest, click on http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20071112-1135-generaldynamics-northrop-navy.html
 
Dec 2, 2000
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From The Navy Newsstand:

Navy Awards Contracts for Zumwalt Class Destroyers
quote:

WASHINGTON (NNS) -- The Navy has exercised contract modifications for the construction of the dual lead ships of the Zumwalt class (DDG 1000) to General Dynamics Bath Iron Works and Northrop Grumman Shipbuilding. DDG 1000 and DDG 1001 are the lead ships of a class of next-generation multi-mission surface combatants tailored for land-attack and littoral dominance.
For the rest, go to http://www.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=35020
 

Jim Hathaway

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Dec 18, 2004
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Hopefully it will be effective, but somehow, I can't picture myself ever wanting to build a model of it for my mantle-
 
Dec 2, 2000
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>>Hopefully it will be effective,<<

I hope the alleged instability issues will be so much hot air from competitors. There's going to be a lot invested in this class of ship. It would be a major scandal if the designers got it wrong.