Help requried in tracking down a ship
- Thread starter ian Hough
- Start date
Dave Gittins
Member
Ian, just for you, I'll look up the details of the ship and the owners tomorrow. I can't promise more than the captain's name.
Dave
Thanx
But before you put to much effort into looking up the details I am particularly interested in John Thompson. According to his Particulars of Engagement on the Titanic his last ship was the Castleford and I was hoping that there may be a similar list giving his address.
Also I was wondering what sort of ship it was (passenger, freight etc), where it sailed from and to
Houghie
Thanx
But before you put to much effort into looking up the details I am particularly interested in John Thompson. According to his Particulars of Engagement on the Titanic his last ship was the Castleford and I was hoping that there may be a similar list giving his address.
Also I was wondering what sort of ship it was (passenger, freight etc), where it sailed from and to
Houghie
Mark Baber
RIP
Hello, Houghie---
I don't see any mention of Castleford in any of the reference works I have at my fingertips. From this, it seems she wasn't a passenger ship of over 10,000 tons (since she's not in Kludas' Great Passenger Ships of the World), nor a passenger steamer engaged in either the North Atlantic or Europe-South America trade (since she's not in Bonsor's North Atlantic Seaway or South Atlantic Seaway).
Not much, but I hope it's of some help.
I don't see any mention of Castleford in any of the reference works I have at my fingertips. From this, it seems she wasn't a passenger ship of over 10,000 tons (since she's not in Kludas' Great Passenger Ships of the World), nor a passenger steamer engaged in either the North Atlantic or Europe-South America trade (since she's not in Bonsor's North Atlantic Seaway or South Atlantic Seaway).
Not much, but I hope it's of some help.
MAB
Thanx everso for trying
wasn't a passenger ship of over 10,000 tons (since she's not in Kludas' Great Passenger Ships of the World),
nor a passenger steamer engaged in either the North Atlantic or Europe-South America trade (since she's not in Bonsor's North Atlantic Seaway or South Atlantic Seaway).
Now I know where not to look
Houghie
Thanx everso for trying
wasn't a passenger ship of over 10,000 tons (since she's not in Kludas' Great Passenger Ships of the World),
nor a passenger steamer engaged in either the North Atlantic or Europe-South America trade (since she's not in Bonsor's North Atlantic Seaway or South Atlantic Seaway).
Now I know where not to look
Houghie
Noel F. Jones
Member
Lloyds Register will give you the salient details of just about every merchant vessel ever operated. I am not conveniently near a set (it is revised annualy) as I write. Having identified your ship you can then proceed to the several repositories of British articles of agreement (crew lists) which should elicit the personal information you require.
A wild guess....
The only Castleford in the UK gazetteer is in West Yorkshire. One company that drew upon this area for its naming policy was Ropner (still extant as Ropner ship Management) whose ships were registered on the northeast coast (Newcastle-upon-Tyne or West Hartlepool?) and were engaged in world-wide tramping.
Noel
A wild guess....
The only Castleford in the UK gazetteer is in West Yorkshire. One company that drew upon this area for its naming policy was Ropner (still extant as Ropner ship Management) whose ships were registered on the northeast coast (Newcastle-upon-Tyne or West Hartlepool?) and were engaged in world-wide tramping.
Noel
Dave Gittins
Member
Lloyd's Register is at my fingertips, but only when they are 20 miles long. At great cost and trouble to the management, we present Castleford!
Registered at Cardiff. Number 115367
Steel single screw steamer. Triple expansion engine of 156 NHP.
1,741 GRT 1,115 NRT.
255.4' LBP 36.7 beam.
Built 1897 by Short Bros, Sunderland.
Master as at 1911 G H Webber.
Owners W J Tillett SS Co, Mount Stuart Square, Cardiff. They owned six small ships in all.
With such low power, she probably pottered round the coast, maybe with coal. After her, Titanic must have been a shock to the system.
Registered at Cardiff. Number 115367
Steel single screw steamer. Triple expansion engine of 156 NHP.
1,741 GRT 1,115 NRT.
255.4' LBP 36.7 beam.
Built 1897 by Short Bros, Sunderland.
Master as at 1911 G H Webber.
Owners W J Tillett SS Co, Mount Stuart Square, Cardiff. They owned six small ships in all.
With such low power, she probably pottered round the coast, maybe with coal. After her, Titanic must have been a shock to the system.
Steve Smith
Member
What was John Thompson's job on Titanic?
I'd always imagined that the majority of the crew came from other White Star ships. Would it be common for someone working for what sounds like a small line (and from a different port) to suddenly jump to a ship like Titanic?
I'd always imagined that the majority of the crew came from other White Star ships. Would it be common for someone working for what sounds like a small line (and from a different port) to suddenly jump to a ship like Titanic?
Inger Sheil
Member
Now that Dave has given you the Official Reg. No., the next trick is finding which archival repository holds her crew agreements - not always an easy task, as the crew agreements and official logs that survive from this period are dispersed quite widely.
The majority are held at the Maritime History Archive in the Memorial University of Newfoundland. A random sample are held at the Public Records Office at Kew. Years ending in 5 at the National Maritime Museum's James Caird Library (Greenwich). Others at archives in Liverpool and other local record repositories around Britain.
The majority are held at the Maritime History Archive in the Memorial University of Newfoundland. A random sample are held at the Public Records Office at Kew. Years ending in 5 at the National Maritime Museum's James Caird Library (Greenwich). Others at archives in Liverpool and other local record repositories around Britain.
Inger
I was just searching through the online local record office where she was registered but as you you say not always an easy task,
Thanx Dave
for all your work I'm more used to tracking down people than ships this is a totally new experience for me.
Steve
John Thompson was a Fireman
in April 1912 was a bad time for shipping as there was a coal strike on and with no Social security I suppose it was a case of if there is work going take it
Only a guess though
Many thanx to all for your work
Houghie
I was just searching through the online local record office where she was registered but as you you say not always an easy task,
Thanx Dave
for all your work I'm more used to tracking down people than ships this is a totally new experience for me.
Steve
John Thompson was a Fireman
in April 1912 was a bad time for shipping as there was a coal strike on and with no Social security I suppose it was a case of if there is work going take it
Only a guess though
Many thanx to all for your work
Houghie
Dave
Thanx again
Whilst looking through a number of sites I came across the title sinking of the SS Castleford in 1879 At first I was worried as J.T. could not have been on it. But thanks to your info I discovered that it was a much earlier ship
Reg. No. 81774
Iron screw steamer
built by Schlesinger, Davis & Co in Newcastle in 1879
Owned by Matthew Cope (A coal merchant)
belonging to the port of Cardiff, Wales
268.5 feet length - 34 feet breadth - 24.8 feet depth and 1752 gross tonnage
It made voyages to London, Madeira, Las Palmas, New Orleans, Baltimore, Rouen and many more.
She was lost with all hands outside Brideford Bay Devon, England on 15 October 1886
Without your help I would have believed she was the one I was looking for - especially as the info was so close.
Hoping for more info to come in tomorrow from a variety of sources on the newer Castleton
Thanx again everyone for all your help
Houghie
Thanx again
Whilst looking through a number of sites I came across the title sinking of the SS Castleford in 1879 At first I was worried as J.T. could not have been on it. But thanks to your info I discovered that it was a much earlier ship
Reg. No. 81774
Iron screw steamer
built by Schlesinger, Davis & Co in Newcastle in 1879
Owned by Matthew Cope (A coal merchant)
belonging to the port of Cardiff, Wales
268.5 feet length - 34 feet breadth - 24.8 feet depth and 1752 gross tonnage
It made voyages to London, Madeira, Las Palmas, New Orleans, Baltimore, Rouen and many more.
She was lost with all hands outside Brideford Bay Devon, England on 15 October 1886
Without your help I would have believed she was the one I was looking for - especially as the info was so close.
Hoping for more info to come in tomorrow from a variety of sources on the newer Castleton
Thanx again everyone for all your help
Houghie
debbie beavis
Member
Ian
She certainly didn't carry passengers or she would appear on my database - she doesn't. I strongly suspect that the crew list you need will be at the Glamorgan Record Office. You can reach them at www.glamro.gov.uk They hold many crew lists for ships registered in Cardiff for this period. The PRO has taken a random 10% for years not ending in 5 (which are at the NMM as Inger explained). The rest are in Newfoundland at the Maritime History Archive.. www.mun.ca/mha/
The official line is that local record offices took only those lists for smaller vessels (and not so small) registered there from 1868 to 1913 but that isn't always the case. Southampton City Archives, for example, holds the crew lists for many P&O or Union Castle Line ships registered in London. When you ask why, the response is '..err....um..' If your ship is among the 10% held by the PRO, and frankly I doubt it, then you will need the class BT99. You can find out how to access the PRO records at their website www.pro.gov.uk BT99 crew list (ship names) have not yet been transcribed into the catalogue so you won't be able to tell without actually visiting the PRO in Kew. The name of a ship Castleford doesn't come up in the catalogue. For more information about tracing 20th century merchant seamen and crew lists you could read the guides I have posted on Mariners website - www.mariners-L.co.uk but please, I know I have to update it for later information!! The information you will need is there and explains how, what and why. Good luck!
Debbie Beavis
She certainly didn't carry passengers or she would appear on my database - she doesn't. I strongly suspect that the crew list you need will be at the Glamorgan Record Office. You can reach them at www.glamro.gov.uk They hold many crew lists for ships registered in Cardiff for this period. The PRO has taken a random 10% for years not ending in 5 (which are at the NMM as Inger explained). The rest are in Newfoundland at the Maritime History Archive.. www.mun.ca/mha/
The official line is that local record offices took only those lists for smaller vessels (and not so small) registered there from 1868 to 1913 but that isn't always the case. Southampton City Archives, for example, holds the crew lists for many P&O or Union Castle Line ships registered in London. When you ask why, the response is '..err....um..' If your ship is among the 10% held by the PRO, and frankly I doubt it, then you will need the class BT99. You can find out how to access the PRO records at their website www.pro.gov.uk BT99 crew list (ship names) have not yet been transcribed into the catalogue so you won't be able to tell without actually visiting the PRO in Kew. The name of a ship Castleford doesn't come up in the catalogue. For more information about tracing 20th century merchant seamen and crew lists you could read the guides I have posted on Mariners website - www.mariners-L.co.uk but please, I know I have to update it for later information!! The information you will need is there and explains how, what and why. Good luck!
Debbie Beavis
Deborah Russes
Member
A shipwreck question...anyone know of anything a barque called the Batavia which wrecked/sank in 1886 (Feb. I believe)? In working with my genealogy, I discovered that an ancestor (William Everett Kelley) a few generations back was lost at sea whiling sailing on this ship. Thank you for any help.
Stanley C Jenkins
Member
I have been asked to find out what happened to a vessel known as the Channel Queen, which was apparently built at South Shields in or about 1921, and subsequently became the Westown. She seems to have been a coaster of about 700 gross tons and was said to have been involved in the Dunkirk evacuation. There is a press report of a fatal collision with the barge Dart in the River Thames on 30 December 1927, but I can find no other details of the Channel Queen/Westown. I wondered if anyone with an interest in British east coast shipping could provide any further details — in particular, what was the eventual fate of the ship?
Stanley C Jenkins
Member
In tracking down this ship I have just been directed to the following site:
http://www.miramarshipindex.org.nz/ship/list?IDNo=1146138&search_op=OR
Which may be of interest to those seeking details of particular vessels.
http://www.miramarshipindex.org.nz/ship/list?IDNo=1146138&search_op=OR
Which may be of interest to those seeking details of particular vessels.
